Marvin Miller for HOF ???

Once again another good example of why these good discussions fall apart.

As far as Billy Martin it seems ridiculas that screening comittee put him on ballot.

 

Yeah, what he said

 

That's exactly what I did in the post preceding yours.

 

"During his 16 years in the game Marvin Miller was the true commissioner of baseball."

--Jim Bouton​

 

Miller will eventually get in. He'll be dead, but he'll get in. The more this era's players get to vote, the more votes he'll get.

You think Ripken's not voting for this guy? Sandberg? Puckett, were he alive? Sutter was one of the earliest cash-ins in the big free agent markets, so I'll bet he's a Miller guy ... that and he's a reasonable fucking man. (Funny how Reggie Jackson's stance toward off-field contributions has softened now that he is making an off-field contribution, ehh?)

I will not necessarily argue that what Miller did was good for the game, as I tend to be a smaller-is-better type, and miss the days of grungy stadiums and guys who played through pain ... though I don't miss the Kingdome when I am sitting in Safeco Field, admittedly. But there is no damn doubt that he is THE GUY who grew the game. He forced owners to pay the players, and thus forced owners to discover new revenue streams if they were to continue to make the kind of money they wanted to make. I miss the old ways, but the game is what it is today -- again, good or bad -- largely because of Miller.

I'm not sure who recommended it earlier, but Lords of the Realm is an eye-opener. If you want to get a feel for Miller's impact, read it. The only guy who could have beaten Miller is the one guy owners would never listen to. Charles O. Finley -- "let 'em all be free agents" -- would have put a real crimp in Miller's legacy.

 

And had the owners listened to Finley, they would have spent a lot less on free agents. What Miller feared most was that the owners, who hated Finley, would for some reason listen to him and simply release every player, flood the market and let every team re-sign any 25 guys they wanted at whatever price they wanted to offer.

And I love Lords of the Realm. Far and away the best book ever written about the business of baseball.

 

I think if you start inducting union bosses and lawyers into the Hall of Fame, it's a small step in inducting scumbags like Scott Boras. The World Golf Hall of Fame inducted an agent this year (Mark McCormack), and that was a travesty.

 

I understand the concern, but I hope we can tell the difference between a pioneer like Marv Miller and a profiteer like Scott Boras. You give the vote to people with knowledge of the game and hope they act on it. In this case, the current group wants Miller out while future groups might want him in. I suppose in that case there well could be a time when guys like Boras are in because enough of their clients have votes. And I agree, that would be unfortunate.

 

But Marvin got it started. Heck, count me in as an HOF vote for him, a lot of good that it does because I don't have a real ballot.

These players were essentially treated like serfs when they were under the old system. Stuck with the same ballclub, minimal salary increases, contracts essentially renewed in perpetuity. Marvin opened up the way to the players to show them what good could be done for increased salaries, better working conditions, etc. Not everyone was a Marvin fan; Carl Yastrzemski questioned Marvin and asked him why he was trying to change the game.

Ya, owners like George have done a lot to lift the salaries of some players to high levels, perhaps too high. But Marvin was the one that got things going.

 

To relate Marvin Miller to Scott BOras is just asinine. No agent is ever going to be elected to the Hall of Fame.

And why is it a travesty that the man who did more than anyone to market the popularity of golf and the PGA is in the World Golf Hall of Fame?
Do you think the PGA Tour etc. would be what it is today without McCormack's promotional and marketing efforts?

 

Hey, McCormack was John Paul II's agent.
Ease up on the guy.

 

There are already a lot of scumbags in the Hall of Fame - Miller isn't one. Every owner and every player in the game owes Miller a debt, becasue he made them all money. steinbrenner buys Yankees just before free agency for $12M, less than $1M of his own money, and today the team in worth around $1B. And for those who think he was bad for the fans, people attend baseball in much higher numbers - albeit at much higher prices, than before free agency.

As for some others on that list, like Phil Wrigley, you gotta be kidding.