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Lena Dunham ‘Raped by a Republican’ Story in Bestseller Collapses Under Scrutiny

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by YankeeFan, Dec 4, 2014.

  1. YankeeFan

    YankeeFan Well-Known Member


    The timing of this is not good, when paired with the UVa story, but did Lena Dunham make up a rape story?

  2. Songbird

    Songbird Well-Known Member

    Who knows. Now Lady Gaga is saying a manager raped her when she was 19.
  3. poindexter

    poindexter Well-Known Member

    The Lena Dunham rape confirms that rape is an act of violence, not sex.
  4. daemon

    daemon Active Member

    Here's a perfect example of why a lot of people -- specifically, but not exclusively, men -- have a difficult time understanding rape in the terms that activists define it.

    To quote the BreitBart piece on Dunham's account of her alleged rape:

    If I am reading that right, Dunham's contention is that the act in question began as consensual sex, and that it turned into rape when Barry took the condom off and became more aggressive than Dunham would have liked. To most rational minds, that would seem like a valid line of reasoning if Barry continued to force himself on her after she objected. But Barry puts the condom backs on after she objects. He takes it off, she objects again, and Barry is kicked out. The next day, Dunham records the act as consensual sex in her weird little "Intimacy Database." It is only after a period of reflection that she decides she has been raped.

    It is this line of reasoning that people struggle to follow. Essentially, "If I decide I was raped, then I was raped." These college rape cases fascinate me, so I've read through many of them, and a significant number of them involve a situation like Dunham describes. The girl who is carrying her mattress around Columbia is one of them.

    Here's a hypothetical scenario:

    Person A invites Person B into their home for dinner. During dinner, Person B excuses himself to visit the bathroom. Person A consents to Person B using the bathroom. But instead of using the bathroom, Person B starts wanders into Person A's bedroom and starts snooping around. Person A tells Person B that he does not have permission to be in the bedroom. Person B leaves the bedroom. Later in the evening, Person B again returns to the bedroom. Person A kicks Person B out of the house.

    Was Person B guilty of criminal trespass?

    It goes without saying that rape is a more serious crime than trespass. But the fundamental legal question in both situations is the same.

    If you reduce Dunham's logic far enough, you reach a point where one party in a sexual encounter is guilty of rape if that party does not receive explicit permission for each thrust. Seriously. Think about it. Dunham's accusation is not far away from that. She writes, "At no moment did I consent to being handled that way." So now the question is, when she consented to sex, what did she consent to? If, during the act, he rolls her over on top of him and smacks her ass, and she did not envision that when consenting to sex, has he just raped her?

    Look, Barry as described by Dunham is a scumbag. But the law cannot possibly cover every potential event once sex is initiated. It is like a business arrangement: once sex is consensual, two people become partners. If one partner bankrupts a business with the decisions that he makes, he might be a bad businessman who ruins the other partner's life, but is he a criminal? Is it victim blaming to say that the partner's life who is ruined should have chosen his or her business partner more carefully?

    I don't know the answers to all these questions, but I know that they need to be discussed, and that such a discussion is extremely difficult to hold in the current climate.
  5. SnarkShark

    SnarkShark Well-Known Member

    So, because Breitbart couldn't verify details, she didn't get raped? That's how this works?
  6. Smash Williams

    Smash Williams Well-Known Member

    You're too smart for that comment, SS. What you can get out of the reporting is Dunham likely used a pseudonym for the man in question while not stating so and in doing that implicated a person who has some, but not all, of the same characteristics or she is intentionally trying to implicate the named person (who as the article shows, is identifiable with cursory research or by those in the community at the time) even though she is misstating some identifying details for some reason.

    As far as daemon's separate point, as a female, I tend to agree with him. I'm very uncomfortable with the idea that something could "retroactively" be considered rape.
  7. MisterCreosote

    MisterCreosote Well-Known Member

    If you start having consensual sex with a condom, then you take the condom off without the woman's consent and resume having sex with her, well, it may not technically be "rape," but it's something he shouldn't do and it should be grounds for the woman to rescind her consent.
  8. daemon

    daemon Active Member

    And it sounds like Dunham rescinded that consent, throwing him out of her room. And if it isn't "technically" rape, then why are we using the word? And how does it feel to somebody who was "technically" raped, who did "technically" say "no you may not put your penis inside my vagina," or who was "technically" incapacitated and taken advantage of?
  9. hondo

    hondo Well-Known Member

    Still waiting for someone to tell me why Lena Dunham is famous.
  10. Starman

    Starman Well-Known Member

    So I guess they've all just forgotten about Dunham's sexual abuse of her sister.
  11. Baron Scicluna

    Baron Scicluna Well-Known Member

    I think she's the University of Alabama-Birmingham version of authors [cross-thread]
  12. BDC99

    BDC99 Well-Known Member

    She's hot? Oh wait, that can't be it. No clue.
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