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John Jeremiah Sullivan on Venus and Serena

Discussion in 'Journalism topics only' started by Double Down, Aug 27, 2012.

  1. Hokie_pokie

    Hokie_pokie Well-Known Member

    I think you're right, Az.

    The first time I sat on press row at Cameron, it took about 45 seconds of game action to realize all the stories I'd heard about Coach K's potty mouth were right on. That man can drop F bombs with the best of em.

    Because he's Coach K, he can tell a referee to go have consenual intercourse with his mother, and there are no repercussions.
     
  2. BTExpress

    BTExpress Well-Known Member

    Doesn't seem to be said on very many tennis courts, does it? McEnroe . . . Serena . . . anyone else? Bueller?

    Can we expect Serena to knock an opponent down just because they do it on football fields every night?

    Bottom line is, while she is an incredible player and competitor, most players act with more class . . . so why wouldn't you root for one of them instead?
     
  3. Azrael

    Azrael Well-Known Member

    Your post is completely unrelated to the point I was making.
     
  4. Lugnuts

    Lugnuts Well-Known Member

    Oh there have been chest bumps at changeovers, racial slurs directed at officials, racquets thrown, cursing in every language imaginable, and somebody's wife slapping somebody.

    Class? C'mon.

    As Mac himself would say, you cannot be serious.
     
  5. BTExpress

    BTExpress Well-Known Member

    Most of your incidents are from the men's game --- by some of its worst personalities (Hewitt, Tarango, etc.) --- and all typically get punished. Jeff Tarango was booed off the court after his Wimbledon incident. Hewitt was booed after his racist remark during the Blake incident. Serena has a history of it that also goes back long before the 2009 incident, too.

    Some fans embrace bad behavior. I don't happen to . . . and sure don't need to be told it's wrong to feel that way.
     
  6. Lugnuts

    Lugnuts Well-Known Member

    If you want an example of a player who plays with class, it's Venus Williams.

    Venus Williams has not been embraced. I have been at tournaments where the American crowd is actively rooting for a white Russian or Eastern European over Venus.

    What has she done to deserve that?
     
  7. BTExpress

    BTExpress Well-Known Member

    Nothing. Other than perhaps a little guilt-by-association (for things her father said or did). Venus has typically shown a lot of class . . . even when you wouldn't expect her to (when the umpire got the score wrong during a Wimbledon tiebreaker).

    And I'm curious which white Russian or Eastern European these fans were cheering for.

    If the name is Sharapova or Kournikova or Ivanovic or Kirilenko or Hantuchova or a handful of other beauties, it's simple --- people root for the prettier player. Several years ago I was at a match between Seles and Kournikova --- Seles a little overweight and at the end of her career. The way the fans favored Kournikova over Seles was sad. But not unusual. Evert-Navratilova, Sabatini-Sukova, same thing. Fans all go crazy for the pretty player.
     
  8. YankeeFan

    YankeeFan Well-Known Member

    Well, either they did, or didn't.

    If they did, someone -- maybe a sports journalist -- should document it, and inform us about it. Maybe ask them if it contributed to their mentality.
     
  9. Double Down

    Double Down Well-Known Member

    I don't deny that phenomenon exists, BTE, but at the same time the (almost exclusively white) audience is also then setting a standard for what they think of as beautiful. Venus is as beautiful as Ivanovic, if not moreso. Kournikova and Hantachova are about as pretty as any tennis player ever, but even Sharapova's reputation as a "stunning babe" reflects people's willingness to elevate a plain looking leggy blonde over a woman of color. Sharapova wouldnt even have been the best looking girl in my college dorm.
     
  10. Lugnuts

    Lugnuts Well-Known Member


    I've lost track of what you're arguing. On the previous page, your initial point was that Serena's 2009 blowup contributed to America not embracing either player.

    Now you seem to be saying it's all about your perception of who is beautiful.

    I'm going to try to go to see the Sloane Stephens/ Tatjana Malek match. Malek plays for Germany. Please let me know in advance who the crowd will be rooting for based on your beauty scale. And please don't forget to factor in the "SportsJournalists.com sliding 6."

    Go ahead and Google her. I'll wait.
     
  11. hondo

    hondo Well-Known Member

    So maybe after realizing the American Dream and getting very rich in the process, perchance could they (especially Serena) lighten the hell up?
     
  12. hondo

    hondo Well-Known Member

    I think Serena is WAY hotter than her sister.
     
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