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Joba Chamberlin

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by Big Chee, Aug 23, 2007.

  1. goalmouth

    goalmouth Well-Known Member

    Seriously, you sound dumber with each post, misspellings notwithstanding. The Yanks WON A WORLD SERIES with Knoblauch.
     
  2. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Yes, that was the point I made earlier. They won from 1996 to 2000 largely with home grown talent. The thing is, you have to HAVE the home grown talent for that to happen. That is an awfully big if and it's a nearly impossible formula to rely on to win every year. It's why they end up buying free agents. Their championships in 1977 and 1978 were done through trades and free agency, by the way. So it isn't a matter of just home grown versus external means. It's a matter of being smart. A smart trade to steal a Graig Nettles of a Mickey Rivers is just as good as the smart trade you avoid making to hold onto an Andy Pettitte or a Bernie Williams.

    Still, baseball now has come down to this: Pitching is what wins. And there is not enough pitching to go around. The result is that it is easier to find a good position players on the free agent market than it is to find a staff full of pitchers every year. If you try to win by buying your pitching, most years you are going to way overpay for guys not worth it and still lose (this is how you end up with a Carl Pavano as easily as you do a Roger Clemens--and why Clemens can dictate such ridiculous terms). So it is smart business to hold onto your good pitching prospects.

    My point just now was that you still can't count on those prospects to turn into aces, though. If you get lucky and they do, you can end up sitting fat and happy like the Tigers with Bonderman, Verlander, Andrew Miller and a guy like Joel Zumaya as your future closer. This is what the Yankees are hoping for with those young pitchers they held fast to. But the names on that list were still largely unproven. And this is still the Yankees we are talking about. If they see an opportunity to buy bridge free agent pitching, rather than going sink or swim with three unproven pitchers in the rotation next year, my strong bet is that they will sign the free agents and have those young arms around to plug in when the injuries hit. That is how Wang ended up in the rotation, for example. If the free agents or trades are there (an if), it will allow them to see who is any good without having to put their full fortunes for the season on the unproven.
     
  3. JackyJackBN

    JackyJackBN Guest

    There has been a similar, season-long discussion in Seattle, regarding Brandon Morrow.

    Part one: why did the M's draft Morrow ahead of Lincecum?

    Part two: why is he relieving in the majors instead of starting in the minors?

    Morrow was pitching for the Cal Bears last year, he's a big strapping kid--much bigger than Lincecum--and he has a crackling fast ball but not much else he can throw for strikes. His problems, and he's had some, have been with control. As the M's have managed to stay in the hunt, the argument about keeping him in the minors for next year has tamped down. Part one remains.

    Without a couple more reliable pitches, Morrow should be relieving. He started the season virtually unhittable; I want to see two months/15-20 outings out of Chamberlain before I form an opinion.

    Morrow is kind of a forgotten man at the moment. You'll hear about him again, no matter which way he develops.
     
  4. hockeybeat

    hockeybeat Guest

    He's become almost as obnoxious as Sterling.

    Yeah, but it was just one. Clearly, the Knoblauch trade was failure.

    Mets would have to be considered a front-runner.
     
  5. 93Devil

    93Devil Well-Known Member

    Didn't take the time to look up his spelling, but I do remember him being an error machine.

    They would have won the WS with almost any other starting 2B in the league. Knobby never even made an all-star team with the Yanks.
     
  6. Big Chee

    Big Chee Active Member

    I don't think there are a set of announcers more hated by its own fanbase than are Kay and Sterling.

    I can't listen to either of those clowns. It was worse when they broadcasted games together.
     
  7. spnited

    spnited Active Member

    The '96 Yankees had 7 regular players on the post-season roster who cameup through their system: Jeter, Bernie Williams, Gerald Williams, Posada, Pettitte, Ramiro Mendoza and Mariano.

    In' 97 thru 2000, that number was 6 "home-grown" players... 3 players and 3 pitchers.

    Hardly laden with "home-grown" talent, Ragu
     
  8. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Spnited, You are missing my point. I am not talking numbers. I am talking about what is actually winning it for you. Derek Jeter, Bernie Williams, Jorge Posada, Andy Pettitte and Mariano Rivera were a core part of the teams that won the championships. They were there for the entire run. They weren't one-year solutions. The team was built around them. So were Paul O'Neill, Scott Brosius, David Cone and various other guys bought or traded for. It comes down to what I said in my post. It's a matter of being smart, not about where the players came from. I'd rather be smart about Derek Jeter, Bernie Wiliams, Jorge Posada and Mariano Rivera than have 22 home grown guys that should be career AAA players. I was talking the smartness with which they went about it, and the quality of those key home grown players. Not about the quantity. If you have 5 or 6 home grown players who are the key to your team's success, that sounds like a lot to me.
     
  9. mike311gd

    mike311gd Active Member


    That's my thinking with Santana. They've got the money, the pieces together for a title, and that's what Santana wants. What the Mets will need, though, is a catcher who commands the trust and respect of the pitching staff.
     
  10. goalmouth

    goalmouth Well-Known Member

    Ask fans of the Royals, Cubs, Rockies, et al, if they would trade for an 'error machine' if it meant winning one World Series. Keep in mind most teams talk long-term but really only care about the present.
     
  11. mike311gd

    mike311gd Active Member

    Knoblauch was, however, a very good top-of-the-order hitter, despite his throwing problems.
     
  12. Pastor

    Pastor Active Member


    FACT.


    Starters are by far more difficult to come by. You can create a very good closer from a mediocre starter. You cannot take a mediocre starter and make them an ace.
     
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