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It shouldn't be this hard

Discussion in 'Anything goes' started by alleyallen, Jun 23, 2008.

  1. ink-stained wretch

    ink-stained wretch Active Member

    Struggle is part of life. Once you accept that, it will get easier.

    And where does it say that life is fair?
     
  2. alleyallen

    alleyallen Guest

    Never indicated that I thought it was a gimme that life was going to be fair. But America has always been touted as a place where a hard-working, good person has a better chance of succeeding and making a better life for their child than they themselves had.
     
  3. buckweaver

    buckweaver Active Member

    Thing is, the "American dream" isn't any less realistic today than it was 50 years ago. Oh, we like to think so -- sure. And in some ways, our parents' lives were easier than our grandparents' lives. And our lives are easier than our parents'. In other ways, life is more difficult -- certainly, more complicated.

    But in terms of opportunities ... good, hard-working people didn't get ahead then any more than they do now. It's always been hard. It's never been fair.

    And I think, in our frustration, we overlook just how hard they had it. And, in different ways, just how hard we have it, too. Not much has changed, regardless of our perceptions of what America was or is "touted" up to be. It's the same as it ever was.
     
  4. shockey

    shockey Active Member

    great ep of "west wing." with eldest shockster off to college in late august. i feel much the same way this dad did. we've built a great life for our kids -- live in a great well-to-do town, great friends, have more income than my folks ever had -- and yet live paycheck-to-paycheck to pay the mortgage and all other bills.

    college fund for the kids? zilch. i didn't have to take a single loan for college back in the day, attending a fine state university in new york. that's what my dad's most proud of, that my sister and i didn't have to take a single loan.

    but a suny school in the mid-to-late '70s was maybe 3,000 bucks a year, tuition/dorm room. the shockster's going to the top suny school. cost today: 18 gs a year.

    you're darn right he'll be in debt when he graduates. my father was amazed until i told him how much it is today. he couldn't believe it. we make three times what my folks ever did, but college will be six times more expensive. and our mortgage is astonomically bigger than the rent my parents paid on their apartment rental.

    damn straight it shouldn't be this hard. what an effed up country, where mrs. shockey and i can make so much more than our parents ever did yet seem to struggle even more.

    god bless america, indeed. ::) ::) ::)
     
  5. Buck

    Buck Well-Known Member

    If you were a homesteader, you might have scrimped and saved your way out of poverty to make your way West, whether it was a time when West was Kentucky or West was California.
    If things worked out well, you had a life of backbreaking labor ahead of you and you only lost one child.
    If things didn't go well, you lost everything during the journey and wound up with less than when you started.
    Infant mortality rates were higher. Death during child birth was more common. Life expectancy was shorter.
    America is supposed to be about opportunity not ease.

    I understand your sentiments. I don't have a kid, but I've felt the same.
    Just try to keep things in perspective. You could be raising your kid in Nigeria or Afghanistan.
    And when things seem to be at their worst, blame the Baby Boomers. Anger is always more satisfying than discouragement.
     
  6. Moderator1

    Moderator1 Moderator Staff Member

    I'm kind of the opposite of you Shockey. I paid the kids' college bills but I'm paying for it in other areas. That's OK. I got off easy. Their school was only 13 grand a year (but I had two a year for three years).

    My daughter is on her own now, she just bought her first car and is very excited. I'm proud of her. She's never been afraid to work her ass off. I went to see her Saturday so she could show off her car and I can't even describe her pride. Wonderful to see.
     
  7. buckweaver

    buckweaver Active Member

    Agree with every bit of this, shockey.

    My parents struggled for a long time, did their very best just to make ends meet. I'm doing the same.

    I didn't get a cent from them for college. Got a couple scholarships, the rest through student loans. I applaud any parents who try to pay for their kids' education, but I don't understand why either side -- the parent or the kid -- thinks that should be expected. Considering what college costs these days.

    But if you really, really want to go to college -- you can get a loan and do it. Pick a small school that doesn't cost as much and apply for FAFSA. Nobody needs their parents' money to pay for school (even though it'll take years and years to pay it off.)
     
  8. ArnoldBabar

    ArnoldBabar Active Member

    With my first on the way, my wife and I have talked a lot about what values are most important to instill. I believe that a strong work ethic will put a child so far ahead of other kids in this generation that it will make a huge difference.

    I see so many kids that have never had to really work for anything, who find the concept of physical labor abhorrent. Kids hit the real world and expect things to be handed to them, then they hit stress and difficulty and don't have the tools to deal with it.

    Do I want my kids to be wildly successful? Yes. But I also want them to have had the experience of working in shitty restaurant jobs and painting houses during the summer. Because it will give them the ability to do what others around them aren't willing to do, and it will make them appreciate what they earn and accomplish.
     
  9. Moderator1

    Moderator1 Moderator Staff Member

    Diligence > Intelligence.

    Now if you can have both, great. Those who combine diligence with intelligence will kick ass.

    But if you give me an ass buster against a genius with no work ethic, I'll take the ass buster 10 days a week.
     
  10. dreunc1542

    dreunc1542 Active Member

    I agree completely with Arnold and Moddy. I'll freely admit that I've had quite the fortunate life, but it's because my parents instilled a great work ethic in me. They worked their butts off to put us four kids through catholic grade school and high school and then they put my three siblings through college. To be fair, they actually paid less for college for two of my siblings than they did for high school.

    I decided, though, early on in high school that I would help out my parents by paying my way through college. However, I didn't actually want to pay so I worked harder than anyone else in my class and was valedictorian. I was not even close to the smartest person in my class but being top of the class was important to me and I worked very diligently to get there. On top of that I took the SATs three times to get my scores up to where I wanted them (that included months of preparation before the last two times I took them). My hard work paid off and I got a full academic scholarship to college. It was the greatest thing to happen to me as it's allowed me to explore Europe and soon both Beijing and LA, but I made it happen by working hard. I apologize for tooting my own horn, but I just wanted to show that hard work can still pay off. So yea, I agree that work ethic trumps intelligence.
     
  11. Moderator1

    Moderator1 Moderator Staff Member

    You have both kiddo and it is a killer combination. Don't slack now! You have asses to kick.
     
  12. dreunc1542

    dreunc1542 Active Member

    Thanks! I am looking forward to kicking asses.

    P.S. I may be coming to you for advice soon on talking to SIDs.
     
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