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Is this a good reason to enjoy college basketball as opposed to the NBA?

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by Devin, Dec 19, 2010.

  1. Small Town Guy

    Small Town Guy Well-Known Member

    Yes, basketball without a shot clock. The excitement was unbearable.


     
  2. Small Town Guy

    Small Town Guy Well-Known Member

    You picked the wrong week to rail about charges not being called in the NBA. ;)



    And I'd actually argue that charging is called too often in the NBA. Floppers still get away with way too much and guys are still allowed to slide under players who are already in the air to gain a cheap charge call that actually shouldn't be whistled. But then, I am the rare basketball fan who likes watching athleticism and grace over flopping.
     
  3. LongTimeListener

    LongTimeListener Well-Known Member

    Charging, flopping, you're probably both right but that highlights another major problem with the NBA -- the officiating is a complete joke and the calls are about things that don't in any way resemble the game most people know. I would rank piss-poor officiating (and my own belief and many others' that the games are fixed to some degree) very high on the list of NBA turn-offs. The NFL is getting the same way with some of the "roughing" calls against Manning and Brady that don't get called against other QBs.
     
  4. 93Devil

    93Devil Well-Known Member

    Of the 10 teams you listed,
    That's right. I keep forgetting about all the Cinderellas in the NBA come May and June.

    Those underdogs like Butler and George Mas..., Orlando Magic just capture my imagination every year.
     
  5. Starman

    Starman Well-Known Member

    Flopping of course is a growing problem in college hoops as well, greatly abetted by ESPN's constant slurping of Duke, one of its greatest practitioners as a team.

    Kids see Dook on teevee three times a week, and hear Dookie Vee splooge his shorts 10 times a game about "great fundamentals" every time one of them does a reverse somersault on court, and decide that's the way the game needs to be played.
     
  6. crimsonace

    crimsonace Well-Known Member

    Watching MSU is akin to porn for a basketball coach.

    Their sets & entries are incredible.
     
  7. 93Devil

    93Devil Well-Known Member

    Izzo might be the best coach in college. If he isn't, he is in the conversation.

    Even after the opposing team scores a basket, the second the ball dropps through the net, his team has a set play to get the ball up the floor to try and get an easy layup for the five.

    The guy can flat out coach. MSU is lucky as shit to have him.
     
  8. crimsonace

    crimsonace Well-Known Member

    I'm a pure man-to-man coach, but the concept of help-and-recover man defense (which "defensive three seconds" is designed to prevent) is important to being able to play good defense.

    The biggest beef most people (myself included) is the wild inconsistency of NBA officials, especially if a marquee team or marquee player is involved. That, and their lack of willingness to call traveling.

    College basketball brought this on itself when it introduced a 19'9" 3-point line (and HS followed). Now, kids from the time they can start heaving a ball do nothing but shoot 3s. It's either layups or 3s, and coaches coach that way. Most offenses set up for college/HS basketball today generally only get post looks, layups or 3-pointers. The old flex and wheel offenses, which rely on the 15-foot jumper, have gone the way of the dodo or they've been extended beyond the arc.

    Any basketball coach will tell you that, the more talented players you have, the better the *defense* will be, not the offense. Watch small-school HS basketball and you'll see a lot of scores in the 70s and 80s (especially if it's 2 good teams), whereas the good big-school teams will be playing in the 40s and 50s, because the quality of defense is so much better when you have better players on the floor.

    Most college teams also have five guys who can hurt you, but they may not be able to play one-on-one "D" at the level that the pros can.
     
  9. crimsonace

    crimsonace Well-Known Member

    Actually, I disagree with that, and I'm a proponent of the longer shot clock.

    The "Showtime" era of the NBA was by far its best era. Get the ball out of the net, get it up the floor and push. One might also note that most teams attempted fewer than 5 3-pointers a game in those days. But the 24-second clock doesn't reward teams much for pushing the ball, and it doesn't reward teams for pressing and trying to make things happen defensively, because even in the half-court game, you only have to play D for about 10-15 seconds a possession.

    However, the 24-second clock causes an overreliance on quick-hitter set plays, and the defensive rules really allow for the offense to clear out and set up its best player one-on-one. Therefore, a lot of the game devolves into standing around, watching said best player (or quickest guard) break his man down one-on-one or get a ball-screen, and either shoot or pitch out for the 3 or hit the roller on a pick-and-roll.

    I'm not advocating "passing the ball around the perimeter" for a minute, and it's not Norman Dale philosophy. But a good 5-man motion offense (such as the Bob Knight motion or Pete Carrill's Princeton offense or the flex or any variation thereof) can be a beautiful offense to watch, and is a lot more entertaining than pass to wing, clear out, pick and roll and pitch for the 3-pointer 120 possessions a game. However, the 24-second clock (and 35-second clock) severely limits the ability for those offenses to operate, because the defense doesn't have to play very hard to stop it. They can sag back in, give up the outside shot, knowing they'll eventually have to chuck the ball.
     
  10. crimsonace

    crimsonace Well-Known Member

    Whenever MSU is on TV, I have a notebook handy. I get more sets out of one game than I do out of any coaching clinic.

    The thing I love -- they push the ball, they rebound hard and their sets are run extremely crisply and full-speed in the half-court. The defense is always back on its heels, because everything is full-tilt, full-speed. Izzo would be a great NBA coach because his style fits the NBA style, but he's a helluva college coach, too.
     
  11. Starman

    Starman Well-Known Member

    Izzo would be a horrible pro coach, because about 10 seconds after he told the players to get under the hoop for the head-bashing "war" drill, about 8 players would be on the cell phones to their agents.
     
  12. 93Devil

    93Devil Well-Known Member

    Yeah, Izzo is perfect right where he is.
     
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