1. Welcome to SportsJournalists.com, a friendly forum for discussing all things sports and journalism.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register for a free account to get access to the following site features:
    • Reply to discussions and create your own threads.
    • Access to private conversations with other members.
    • Fewer ads.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon!

HS student kicked out of honors class for cheating; parents sue

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by LongTimeListener, Apr 26, 2012.

  1. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    While I suggest homework exercises in my (university-level) classes, I never grade them. That doesn't mean, however, that I think homework shouldn't be graded. There are times when it should be. One rationale for grading homework is that students who don't (supposedly) "test well" can demonstrate knowledge of subject matter in a manner that's more consistent with their skillset. Another rationale for grading homework is that, since homework can be a powerful means of honing skills/knowledge, grading it is a way to make damn sure that students are doing all they can to learn the material. You can also push students a lot harder with homework (i.e., you can get them to take on much more challenging tasks/problems with homework than you can with exam questions).

    As to your suggesting that it's unacceptable to assign homework over material that wasn't "taught" in class, I have to disagree with you there as well. No, 5th graders shouldn't be asked to do graded work that wasn't visited in class. On the other hand, high school students can (and probably should) occasionally be asked to take what they know (i.e., what's been dealt with in class) and run with it a bit. A huge battle that today's educators face is the idea of "compartmentalization of knowledge," with ostensibly educated students being unable to draw on what they've learned elsewhere when confronted with a novel task. Forcing (via graded homework) students to push their boundaries can be a very useful pedagogical tool.

    Even as a doctoral student (and a teacher of/advisor to doctoral students), I have frequently encountered a mindset of "If it wasn't covered in a course, I shouldn't be expected to know it." Sorry, life doesn't work that way. I don't think I've ever published a paper that didn't require me to learn some wholly new (to me) statistical method.
     
  2. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    If the homework is to be graded, and it has been stipulated that the student is to work alone in doing the homework, then copying homework is just as bad an academic dishonesty infraction as copying answers on a test. Just a few years ago I caught several masters-level students collaborating on (and handing in virtually identical versions of) a graded problem set when they had been told clearly and emphatically that they were to work alone. Those students wound up paying a severe price for their decision to decided on their own rules.
     
  3. Ace

    Ace Well-Known Member

    I don't like when teachers require kids to work together.

    In one of my son's classes, students are required to work together on classwork, and one of the group is supposed to turn it in. Guess which class is the only one my son has a lot of late/missing classwork?

    In another class students were supposed to work together on tests. Somehow, my son's scores were always a lot lower than the other kids in his group he worked with until I talked to the teacher to ask her to explain how that could be. She couldn't and there wasn't a problem after that.
     
  4. Baron Scicluna

    Baron Scicluna Well-Known Member

    Totally agree.

    My son's best friend is a 5th grader in a private school. She's given hours of homework, per night. Her parents push her, and she revolts and misbehaves in class. She does it because she's stressed out.

    When I was in school, my grades weren't as good because, to me, homework was just a pain in the ass. A lot of it was just busywork, and I barely learned anything from it. I'd do it during lunch, studyhalls and on my bus, just to get it over with. Once I went to college, my grades actually got better because the work was more focused. We weren't given a half-dozen worksheets to fill out just to fill them out.
     
  5. LongTimeListener

    LongTimeListener Well-Known Member

    Have you investigated the possibility that the other kids were boning the teacher?

    #toomuchtimeonsj
     
  6. 93Devil

    93Devil Well-Known Member

    This is a great mindset for higher education, and there are options for students to go above and beyond in their out of class work, but if a student is struggling to do the minimum, do you really think it is wise to start asking them to do above and beyond?

    Projects are a great way to give an example of a "homework" that could be graded, but I would be very careful to give students the ability to in some way complete the projects on the school grounds if they were not able to at home. Projects are also a way for students to show how brightly they can shine.
     
  7. 93Devil

    93Devil Well-Known Member

    Group work is very important. One of the highest levels of thinking is teaching the material to other students or explaining it to them.

    The concept of group work is very good, it might not be handled or organized best in that one classroom.
     
  8. HanSenSE

    HanSenSE Well-Known Member

    But if we don't give our kids hours of homework, the Japs are gonna pass us ...
     
  9. jr/shotglass

    jr/shotglass Well-Known Member

    When I saw this thread had 3 pages, I knew, just knew, that somebody (or somebodies) had actually gone and played devil's advocate for the other side.

    Then again, it wouldn't be an SportsJournalists.com thread if that hadn't happened.

    Maybe the kid can get a participation trophy so his parents don't get so mad.
     
  10. Ace

    Ace Well-Known Member

    Sure, the concept is great. But for middle school and high school kids it sucks. Most have the social interaction skills of tree slugs. So unless your are paired with friends, you are very likely to be in a group where no one wants to take charge, or where one person does all the work or no one does the work.

    Expecting four kids to divvy something up equally and discuss the material and have some give and take is pie in the sky thinking -- especially if it's not a top-level class.
     
  11. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    Depends on the class. Group work is best done either in class or with some in class and some for homework, so the teacher can make sure every student in the group is taking on part of the work.
     
  12. 93Devil

    93Devil Well-Known Member

    Most people will learn with either their hands, eyes or ears. Most are best learning with a combination, but some cannot learn at all if all they have is one type of learning. Assign tasks in the group that plays to each student's strengths. For example, one student might write a synopsis of the project while another might give the oral presentation. The third and fourth could build the project that is being discussed.

    If I want to have students learn about the Russian place in WWII, is reading 20 pages and writing 10 answers really the best way to do it? Or to have me drone on for 30 minutes? Pop in a video? A website?
     
Draft saved Draft deleted

Share This Page