Health Care - Get It Done

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

Found this from 1999 so I'm sure the math is worse now but the logic still applies.
CDC Estimates Cost of Smoking
Excerpt By Erin McClam, AP

ATLANTA - Each pack of cigarettes sold in the United States costs the nation $7 in medical care and lost productivity, the government said Thursday.


The study by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention put the nation's total cost of smoking at $3,391 a year for every smoker, or $157.7 billion. Health experts had previously estimated $96 billion.

Americans buy about 22 billion packs of cigarettes annually. The CDC study is the first to establish a per-pack cost to the nation.

The agency estimated the nation's smoking-related medical costs at $3.45 per pack, and said job productivity lost because of premature death from smoking amounted to $3.73 per pack, for a total of $7.18.

The average cost of a pack of cigarettes in 1999 was $2.92.

"There's a big difference in the cost to society and what society is getting back in tax," said the CDC's Dr. Terry Pechacek. "We believe society is bearing a burden for the individual behavioral choices of the smokers."

The CDC said it analyzed expenses, both personal and for the health care industry, and used national medical surveys to calculate the costs to the nation.

The agency also reported that smoking results in about 440,000 deaths a year in the United States, up from the government's previous figure of 430,000, established in the early 1990s. The new study was conducted from 1995 to 1999.

"The fact that nearly half a million Americans lose their lives each year because of smoking-related illnesses is a significant public health tragedy," said Dr. David Fleming, the CDC's acting director.

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

In '00, maybe.

Quoting myself: "Voting for Bush in '00 was a misdemeanor. Voting for Bush
in '04 was a felony."

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

I have a really novel idea for both sides - instead of trying to jam a bad bill down our throats just to have something to brag about before the election, how about scrapping the whole thing and starting from scratch on a bill that might actually make sense and might actually have a chance in hell of solving whatever problems we are allegedly trying to solve?

I mean, seriously, even if it takes a whole year to thoughtfully study and work out the kinks on and find a pragmatic and workable solution -- isn't that worth it given the enormity of what is at stake here.

Make no mistake, this "healthcare debate" and posturing is Bad Government 101 -- and like every bill that is rushed through for the wrong reasons (usually to try and win elections), this will be one that won't fix the "problems" we are allegedly trying to fix, one that will cost far more than originally thought and one that will no doubt have some unintended consequences which are worse for some than what we have today.

Just a thought.

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

Doc - in your ER what percentage of cases come in that could be attributed to drugs or alcohol? This would included related accidents.

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

The bill's been debated for 50 years. Just get it done and adjust on the fly. You have to start somewhere. One more year may put us in situation where votes are not there.

There is opportunity now for majority vote and a President willing to sign on the dotted line. It may not happen for a while again.

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

Federal tax on cigarettes is $1.01 per pack. States vary. Perhaps Feds should require a minimum level of state taxiation to receive Federal medical funds. Here is breakdown:
orted By Tax Rate
State Tax Rate
(per pack of 20)
Rhode Island $3.460
Connecticut $3.000
New York $2.750
New Jersey $2.700
Hawaii $2.600
Wisconsin $2.520
Massachusetts $2.510
District of Columbia $2.500
Vermont $2.240
Washington $2.025
Arizona $2.000
Alaska $2.000
Michigan $2.000
Maryland $2.000
Maine $2.000
New Hampshire $1.780
Montana $1.700
Delaware $1.600
Pennsylvania $1.600
Minnesota $1.560
South Dakota $1.530
Texas $1.410
Iowa $1.360
Florida $1.339
Ohio $1.250
Oregon $1.180
Arkansas $1.150
Oklahoma $1.030
Indiana $0.995
Illinois $0.980
New Mexico $0.910
California $0.870
Colorado $0.840
Nevada $0.800
Kansas $0.790
Utah $0.695
Mississippi $0.680
Nebraska $0.640
Tennessee $0.620
Kentucky $0.600
Wyoming $0.600
Idaho $0.570
West Virginia $0.550
North Carolina $0.450
North Dakota $0.440
Alabama $0.425
Georgia $0.370
Louisiana $0.360
Virginia $0.300
Missouri $0.170
South Carolina $0.070

Lower taxes heavily weighted towards the South

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

This may come as a shock to some but society already does cover the costs for people who choose not to care for themselves. In an extremely costly and inefficient manner.

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

Or you could also say that lower taxes are heavily weighted towards most of the places that actually grow tobacco.
Let's not forget the influence of wealthy farmers in rural states.

Companies already give incentives for healthy behavior like nonsmokers have lower cost health insurance and, in some places, the physically fit have lower insurance as well.

The problem with that approach is that for insurance companies to make the profit they want, they need healthy people to pay in as much as the sick people. Insurance, in a way, is a giant ponzi scheme based on that people will continue to pay relatively high premiums to cover the cost of the relatively few sick.

You can't have health care reform, without the reform of the health insurance industry.

I wish I could find the poll, but I saw one where people who never filed a claim were the ones most satisfied with their insurance and the more claims filed, the more the satisfaction dropped.
I think that's a pretty telling number.

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

Who stole Boom's login?

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

Since the supermajority went down to 59-41, it's pretty obvious to most people that there is no way on Earth the Republicans will get behind any reform bill, ever. So the bill before us is the only bill that's going to have a chance unless the Dems get back to 60 votes (or probably more, given the cajoling and bribery it took to get even this far). That doesn't seem likely to happen for a long, long time and may never happen again. Scrapping it and starting over is an exercise in futility.

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

Go take a walk around the hospital where my wife works and see who the patients are. You'd see a lot of truth in that statement.

 

Re: Health Care - Get It Done

I just want to say that I'm very encouraged by the level of discourse on this thread. I don't think the reset button is necessary for health care reform, but maybe it was for the SportsJournalists.com Politics board.

This is our 'clean sheet of paper!!'