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Grimsley names Clemens

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by Day Tripper, Sep 30, 2006.

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  1. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    FB, For most people who care about this it isn't about the war on drugs. It's about fair play and competing within the rules without cheating. I don't give a shit if you inject yourself with enough testosterone to make your balls explode. Knock yourself out.

    But as a fan of sports, cheating bothers me. I wished it bothered more people. It is where being libertarian doesn't work. Sports have rules; need rules. And this isn't just a little bit of bending of the rules. It's guys giving themselves artificial ability way beyond their natural talent. It is the most egregious form of cheating possible. If the allegations about Clemens are true, and if he ratcheted up the cheating right around the time he went to the Blue Jays, Dan Duquette is suddenly looking vindicated. It also puts the last 8 to 10 years of Clemens career under suspicion--years that turned him from a great pitcher to an immortal pitcher. That makes him a fraud (not in the frivolous way the word often gets used on this site).
     
    The Big Ragu, Oct 1, 2006
    #37
  2. deportes

    deportes Member

    first of all, great story and scoop by lance pugmire. dude is a class act, and no i’m not lance.

    but seriously, where’s the houston chronicle on this story?
     
    deportes, Oct 1, 2006
    #38
  3. Football_Bat

    Football_Bat Well-Known Member

    The Chronicle? Clemens?

    [​IMG]
     
    Football_Bat, Oct 1, 2006
    #39
  4. Columbo

    Columbo Active Member

    Same place the Vegas paper was when the Times uncovered the payola schemes to judges in Lost Wages last year.
     
    Columbo, Oct 1, 2006
    #40
  5. deportes

    deportes Member

    just read richard justice's latest blog entry on the subject:

    The Los Angeles Times broke the story that will dwarf all others, the ones that accuses Roger Clemens and Andy Pettitte of using performance-enhancing drugs. So Saturday might be the last happy news cycle around the Astros for awhile.

    As for the game itself, the Astros and Braves begin play about an hour before the Cardinals and Brewers on Sunday...

    really? embarrassing. give me your take and not some drivel.
     
    deportes, Oct 1, 2006
    #41
  6. lantaur

    lantaur Well-Known Member

    Baltimore Sun got the three Orioles players to talk, although none of them said too much other than deny the accusation and say they barely knew Jason Grimsley:

    http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/baseball/bal-te.sp.grimsley01oct01,0,2994301.story?coll=bal-sports-baseball
     
    lantaur, Oct 1, 2006
    #42
  7. DyePack

    DyePack New Member

    There's a surprise.
     
    DyePack, Oct 1, 2006
    #43
  8. Columbo

    Columbo Active Member

    BYH....

    Did I miss your screed on the umpteenth crucial game that Clemens has not come up big in, the two runs in six innings in Atlanta Friday?
     
    Columbo, Oct 1, 2006
    #44
  9. bigpern23

    bigpern23 Well-Known Member

    Maybe I'm naive, but I've never really bought the MJ theory. That aside, I postd on here back in May or June that Clemens was going to come back after 51 games, one game longer than a first offense for performance enhancers. I've thought for a long time that he was on the juice (all those pulled muscles whenever he tried to field a ball plaing for the Yanks had me suspicious) and I always wondered about the timing of his return.

    That said, I'm not just going to buy everything Grimsley says hook, line and sinker. He fingered six teammates, all of whom were stars except Segui (who was a decent player in his own right). I just find it a bit weird that he didn't mention any of the joe schmoe players on his teams, some of whom were surely using. And Ragu's point about the distinction he made between PEDs for Pettite and Clemens and anabolic steroids for the others is a good one.
     
    bigpern23, Oct 1, 2006
    #45
  10. Roger_Clemens

    Roger_Clemens New Member

    I did not have sex with that woman, Miss Lewi....no, that ain't it....um...I wasn't throwin at the guy, it just sorta....wait, I got it here somewhere....check's in the mail....heck, Deb, where that notecard at....

    OH! Got it here--It was supplerments! Yeah, I had one of them whaddayacallits, you know, a reaction! To the supplerments! I don't see no big deal there, my own kids take them Flintstomes chewables, this ain't much different, see what I'm sayin? Hell, I got 22 million reasons to be tellin you the truth here! This Grimsley guy, he got no reasons at all!
     
    Roger_Clemens, Oct 1, 2006
    #46
  11. Boobie Miles

    Boobie Miles Active Member

    I'm sure others would no better than I, but I believe he only gave info on players that he was asked about so presumably he was only asked about big names players.
     
    Boobie Miles, Oct 1, 2006
    #47
  12. The Big Ragu

    The Big Ragu Moderator Staff Member

    Well, about all I can say about it is that I'm hardly alone. And at least I formed my suspicions based on 1) having been around the guy and seeing his tree trunk thighs actually get bigger throughout his 30s, 2) conversations with people (including one front office person, in particular, whose observations about one player proved remarkably true) whose speculation about who is using have seemed credible and insightful (even without proof), 3) and the pretty logical observation that it is impossible to gain velocity on your fastball in your 30s after a down season in which you looked like were starting your decline.

    But I'm hardly the first person who made those observations about Clemens. And nothing has been proven... But still... I know it's a huge joke to you Dyepack, but the reality is that the number of major league baseball players who have used steroids or HGH over the last 10 to 15 years numbers in the hundreds of players. Clemens and Bonds get the attention because they have had the most distinguished careers, but the prevalence of usage is pretty clear to people who are actually around the game... as unlikely as it seems to a guy who spends all day posting on message boards. It might be worth talking to a few of people with actual insight, if you are able to, rather than being a snarky message board troll.
     
    The Big Ragu, Oct 1, 2006
    #48
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