Green Day > Nirvana, Pearl Jam, etc.?

I'm not a very big fan of Green Day, but I don't think you're recollection of their emergence into national attention.
It was very well known that they were from the remnants of the Berkeley punk/hardcore scene.
It seemed like the early stuff I remember reading was always about how the people from that scene thought they were sellouts because of their pop arrangements and production.

Anyway, as someone who was into some hardcore back in the 1980s, I thought Green Day was alright. I've gotten a little bored with them when they decided to get political.
And I get a little bored with most of the pop-punk knockoffs that have risen in popularity over the past 10 years.

Nirvana was brilliant.

Pearl Jam sucks.

 

I weep for you.

 

Ed's actually far from humorless. He's a pretty funny dude. You won't do it, but if you can get a hold of bootlegs from his recent solo tour, some of the stories he tells are just fabulous.

Of course, he was a funny dude back in the day, too. The 1993 Indio show, which came unglued when the crowd decided to all throw their shoes at the band, comes to mind. "I'm going to stand at the gates on the way out and beat the shit out of every barefoot person here."

Your point about Creed, though, stands.

 

I think I've already made the point, but my problem isn't with the FACT Green day has changed. It is HOW they have changed, and the direction they have taken.

Change, on its own, isn't always neccesarily a good thing.

 

Seriously, you should download "Vicious Circle," the album I referenced earlier. It was pretty revolutionary for hardcore in that it wasn't recorded like you were slamming out for 20 minutes in a public restroom, even though the band did the recording DIY and didn't have a label. It's currently on something like it's fifth re-release, and it sells more every time (granted, it's not like it sound a million the first time around). Just because "Vicious Circle" has space between the instruments and features the best bass east of Mike Watt doesn't make it pop-punk. Then again, one of the re-releases was from Green Day's old label, Lookout, so you get an idea of how punks figured out that maybe you could try to sound hardcore yet not sound like vomit, in a bad way.

 

I don't dislike Pearl Jam, but Vs. is dated. So is Ten. Based on the uber-Pearl Jam fans I've been around, I always thought Vs. was viewed as one of their worst albums.

Once they got to Vitalogy, they changed their sound a bit and it stands up better. I still like Corduroy a lot.

 

Are you saying there's not enough space on 'Double Nickels on the Dime' or 'Plastic Surgery Disasters' or 'Who's Got the 10 1/2'?
Blasphemer!

 

They were all after "Vicious Circle," and they were also by bands in areas with established scenes (and real recording studios). But, hey, I love those bands, too, and Minutemen were great in that they had a punk ethos, but they weren't afraid to show they actually knew how to play.

 

Blaming Pearl Jam for Creed is like blaming Zeppelin for every POS metal band.

It makes no sense.

 

I just question the take, earlier in this thread, that Pearl Jam was the biggest band in the world "for years."

Sure, they had an argument. But based on album sales and ticket sales, both Metallica and U2 (and maybe even (shudder) Oasis) had a pretty good case too, even in Pearl Jam's prime years.

 

From 1992-94/95, I don't think there's much argument.

Grunge explosion/Ten takes off/Eddie's on the cover of Time/Jeremy video/Singles appearance and soundtrack/co-headline Lollapalooza/Vs. released and sets all-time record for first week/Ticketmaster battle begins/Vitalogy released and it's the second-fastest selling album ever/etc.

Had they tried to keep up that pace, they'd have flamed out in a hurry. I'm glad they did what they did.

In contrast, Metallica was certainly huge with the Black Album, during that period, but they followed that up with Load and went into relative obscurity.

U2 releases Achtung Baby during that time frame, but they get pretty bogged down in the Zoo TV thing and follow it with Zooropa. There's a reason why they said the were "reapplying for the job of best band in the world" when Pop came out. They didn't have it for a while.

 

I actually agree with you, as does the band for the most part, Bubs. They really didn't like how Vs. turned out -- and you can hear the differences on Vitalogy and Yield.

You can also check out the track listing from shows to see the songs they think held up... Still in regular rotation from Ten are Even Flow, Alive, Black and Porch. (I'm personally just over Even Flow. They didn't play Alive for a long time but have brought it back recently, I think. Porch is still a freaking killer tune live. Ditto Black) Off of Vs. they still play Daughter every show and Rearviewmirror and Elderly Woman still pop up occasionally. I've heard them play Glorified, Go, and Animal, too, but I don't think they make the cut most nights. (Go can be a rocker in concert)