Edgar Martinez - Hall of Famer?

Andruw Jones' 422 career home runs is the one for me. Fucking guy was a scrub and only 31.

 

On the very first page of this thread, you asked someone to support their statement.

Yet, when people ask you to do the same, you come up with lame ass photos of yourself. Yet more proof you have lost the argument.

 

Isn't it possible that the Mariners kept him in Triple-A in an (ultimately futile) effort to develop him defensively?

His fielding percentage at Tacoma from ages 24-26 dropped from .949 to .925 to .867 (.833 at 3B that last season).

 

It is possible. But Presley was terrible at third so Seattle still probably would have come out on top playing Martinez anyway.

I just really think that Mariner management at the time didn't realize what they had with a lot of guys. Look at that stretch 1987-89 and see the number of plate appearances they gave to bad/awful offensive players when they had better alternatives on the bench or in the minors.

 

Still waiting to hear why Lefty Grove sitting in the minors for five years because his general manager (slash owner/manager) wouldn't sell him to the majors is not comparable to Edgar Martinez sitting in the minors for five years because his general manager wouldn't promote him.

 

It's not the same situation.

The Orioles at the time were competing against the major leagues and trying to independently make money for themselves. The system was entirely different compared compared to any standard after about 1960.

Martinez was already in the control of a major league franchise.

 

Yes. I get that.

And yet, the effect on their careers and their ability to contribute at the major level was exactly the same. Why should Martinez get some sort of credit for being held back, when Grove and others don't?

 

Grove being held back obviously didn't hurt his ability to be considered a hall of famer -- instead of 300 wins he'd have 347?.

I haven't seen any other examples listed here besides Martinez where that would apply. And I'm not talking about an injury situation that is out of someone's control.

 

Still irrelevant to any discussion of Martinez's qualifications for the Hall of Fame. He will be judged on what he did at the major-league level, as he should be.

 

That's because Grove's actual major league accomplishments are Hall of Fame-worthy.

Martinez's aren't. Why should he get extra credit for not having a Hall of Fame career?

Well, Jackie Robinson and Roy Campanella had legitimate Hall of Fame careers regardless of being held back by the color line, just like Ichiro Suzuki has had a Hall of Fame career regardless of the Japanese posting system limitations that forced him to be held back from MLB until age 27.

But Monte Irvin and Larry Doby did not post Hall of Fame numbers in the major leagues, and they're enshrined in large part because they were great players who were held back from the chance to do so. So that's about the only precedent I can find for players who would otherwise not be Hall of Famers except for forces out of their control. And Martinez surely isn't in that class.

I fail to see where his case is so special that he deserves consideration that no one else in the history of the game has gotten when he didn't post Hall of Fame numbers.

 

Excuse me junior - I presented my case several times.
With supporting evidence.
Try to keep up.
Or just get lost.
We don't need you on here to keep score.
(But if you're scoring at home, OOP hasn't proved a dam thing.)

 

You made one ridiculous argument after another and got soundly shouted down on all of them. Interesting definition you have for "making your case."