DUI checkpoints

And it is fundamentally wrong. It is not illegal to drive after midnight, on any stretch of highway. It is also illegal for the police to pull people over without probable cause. Operating a car after midnight, or at any other time of the day, is not probable cause in and of itself.

And being pulled over at random and being asked to show your papers is the stuff of fascist regimes.

 

They don't have to have "probable cause" to search you. The standard is "reasonable suspicion." Driving after midnight on a Friday or Saturday night almost certainly gives an officer reasonable suspicion that you are impaired.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_v._Ohio

 

As I said, being pulled over at random and being asked to show your papers is the stuff of fascist regimes. Whether the Ohio State Supreme Court says it's legal, or not.

But of course in Ohio, the governor can also call out the state National Guard to break up a perfectly legal protest, shoot to death four innocent civilians, and wound nine or 10 others, with no legal ramifications whatsoever.

 

Hmm ... I came across a checkpoint one time and it looked like the cop took one look and decided I was sober, so he waved me through...

 

I completely understand KYSW's frustration, and can fully believe that some officials could make this process as ridiculous as humanly possible.

But if it gets 1-2 drunks off the road - and scares countless others or at least makes them think about doing it (again) - it's worth it.

As much as people have been banging the drum not to drink and drive, there are still a lot of tone-deaf imbibers. Knock yourselves out at the bar ... but hand over the keys, please.

 

No. This is not logical. What if you expend the same amount of resources and get 10 drunks off the road instead? What if you could expend less resources and get five drunks off the road and use the rest of the resources to stop five robberies in progress? These decisions do not take place in a vacuum. They must be compared against other alternatives that might be more efficient. If this is the most efficient way to prosecute and deter drunk driving, sign me up - I'm on the record on this thread as saying I'm fine with it, from a reasonable search standpoint. But catching a person or two does not necessarily justify the expenditure of resources in this manner. It just doesn't.

Your line of reasoning is used all the time to rationalize our anti-terrorism programs, as well.

 

Outside of Hackyville, they will occasionally set up a checkpoint on what is normally an desolate stretch of interstate about 20-30 miles outside of town. Signs, orange barrels, the whole thing, to make it look like that it's on the interstate. Except that there is no actual checkpoint on the interstate ... it's on the exit/entrance ramp people think they're using to bypass the supposed checkpoint.

 

What else are they doing on most nights?

If they're making rounds to make an apartment complex that's had a break-in or a couple of stalkers safer, then I get your point. If they're answering a few domestic disputes and keeping a couple of women or children safe, good.

But your answer assumes that there is always a better usage for the manpower, Dick. If there isn't, then this is a good answer. And bet on most of these departments being smart enough to stake out a place where there's more than an odd offender or two.

 

I'd be pissed even if I was stone-sober. This is the United States. The police should not be able to randomly stop your car, ask for yourpapers, and prove to them you are sober, no matter what time of the day it is. That's how totalitarian regimes act.

You have probable cause? I'm weaving, etc.? Pull me over. But under no stretch of imagination does simply driving after midnight give an officer "reasonable suspicion" that you are impaired, especially since he has no way of knowing how well you were or were not driving before you approached the roadblock. The stats mentioned earlier in this thread - only one of more than 800 drivers was found to be DUII - prove that.

Feel free to surrender your civil liberties. But don't mess with mine, please.

 

My grandfather used to always tell us, "Driving is a privilege, not a right."

He kind of changed his tune when his eyesight got bad and his reaction time slowed way down, and we had to take away his car keys.

When my younger brother said, "Karma's a bitch, isn't it, Granddad?" he just about got hit with a cane.

 

You surrender your civil liberties every time you walk through the security line at the airport. Not sure I see the distinction here.

Here's a list of states and (un-)constitutional checkpoints.

www.ghsa.org/html/stateinfo/laws/checkpoint_laws.html

 

I tend to agree. The key is enforcement and judgment.

I was pulled many moons ago, when I commuted about an hour each way from my hometown to where I was working not far from my home-away-from-home if you will. Cop in the stopover town pulled me over, claimed he saw me swerve once or twice.

It was about 0100 and I had just finished another long shift (i.e., more than eight hours). I was doing maybe 47 in a 45 ... given that it was a four-lane road, only an offense in the strictest interpretation of the law and nothing more. In this state, a judge would laugh a citation for that out of the courtroom unless there was ice all over the road and/or obscenely thick fog.

Cop also asked, with a smirk if I had been drinking anything. The smirk was so annoying, I replied with "Yes ... Sprite."

I SLOWLY pulled the plastic logo-ed bottle from behind the seat to show the cop. He continued to look around my machine, convinced I was hiding something. I urged him to offer me a breathlyzer and to search the vehicle as he pleased. All he was going to find was a small overnight bag in case I got stuck at work, a pair of jumper cables and some tools.

He quickly turned tail and said "Have a nice day," in a tone about as sincere as a used car salesman's.

Not a minute later, he and another colleague in a similarly decorated cruiser were pulling someone else over for no reason. Then I looked at my watch ... the last day of the month. Quota, anyone?