Does Damon Allen belong in the Football Hall of Fame? Marino says no Moon, yes

Lyman_Bostock · Sep 6, 2006

Re: Does Damon Allen belong in the Football Hall of Fame? Marino says no Moon,

dooley_womack1 said:

Huggy said:

Lyman_Bostock said:

dooley_womack1 said:

And wasn't as good a wrestler as his dad, Rocky Johnson. The degrading things he and other pioneering black wrestlers like Rufus R. Jones and Bobo Brazil had to do to pave the way for Ron Simmons and the Rock.
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Bobo Brazil, "the world's greatest black wrestler." Brings back a lot of memories of TV wrestling on Sunday mornings. He did a TV ad for a grocery store in Chicago, on the south side, where, in very stilted acting, he'd buy "beer and chitlins by the case."

Wrestling was a lot more fun when the matches were held in TV studios and shown on UHF channels.
Click to expand...

Rocky Johnson was also a one-time sparring partner for a young George Foreman.

Bobo Brazil and the immortal Sweet Daddy Siki were also regulars on All Star Wrestling up here.
Click to expand...

Brazil's finishing move was the "cocoa headbutt." They gave him the name Bobo to make him sound like an ape, then gave him a finishing move that they gave almost all the black wrestlers, to imply that blacks had hard heads and weren't smart enough to apply the sleeper or the figure-four. And they always made Rocky Johnson say, "I came to stay, not to play," and have him do all kinds of "shuckin' and jivin," so the chitlins' ad is no surprise. The only old-school black wrestler they gave normal wrestling traits to was Ernie Ladd, cos he was entering wrestling after being famous in pro football, so he had an already-known personality, and leverage.

And Lyman, I hear you on the UHF and the studio shows. Wrestling at the Chase was appointment TV on Sunday mornings. I think the last vital studio show was the one in Memphis.
Click to expand...

"Time for Wrestling at the Chase! Call a friend!"

A buddy of mine was sitting at home one day when he got a call from a friend (not me), telling him "Wrestling at the Chase" was on TV. Behold the power of TV advertising.

Lyman_Bostock · Sep 6, 2006

JR said:

DyePack said:

So when do we start debating the metric system? They stopped promoting it around here, and I think that's a slap in the face to Canadians everywhere.
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No, we adopted the metric system to keep up with the rest of the world. I guess they thought most of you guys would never figure it out.
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Even by smug-Canadian standards, JR is a real piece of work.

huntsie · Sep 6, 2006

We get it: Americans don't respect the CFL and/or don't know what they're talking about. The Pro Football Hall of Fame is for NFLers only. Those points were made how many pages ago? And this whole debate degenerated into stupidity (sigh) seven or eight pages ago.

outofplace · Sep 6, 2006

Gomer said:

outofplace said:

Do you really think there is a NFL Hall of Famer who couldn't have been even better in the CFL?

Yeah, Joe Montana would have just sucked if he'd had to see even more of the field. How on Earth would Jerry Rice have gotten open with even more open field to cover.

The CFL's rules make things easier on the quarterbacks and receivers in particular, giving them more room to work with. That definitely diminishes the accomplishments of a player like Allen. Not only has he faced dramatically inferior competition, but he's done it with rules that make things easier for him.
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Funny you'd mention that the rules make it easier for quarterbacks and receivers, then use a quarterback and a receiver as your example that EVERY NFL hall of famer would tear up the CFL. Defensive players need to be faster to cover a bigger field, so I'd guess a lot of the NFL's top guys might have had problems.

Also, the running game isn't nearly as north-south smashmouth in the CFL, which is why Ricky Williams isn't doing so well. Barry Sanders would've ripped it up for sure, but others not suited to the different style of play wouldn't have.
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Actually, I was talking about the passing game because this thread began with a discussion of Allen, a quarterback. The rules of the game as compared to the NFL favor quarterbacks, which has helped to boost his numbers.

And JR, it is significantly inferior talent. Not awful or meaningless, but definitely inferior.

Would Allen have gotten his NFL shot if he came up now as opposed to 22 years ago? Yes. Would he have been a star? Maybe, but he'd have to do it against much better athletes with rules that make things a good bit more difficult for him.

shotglass · Sep 7, 2006

huntsie said:

We get it: Americans don't respect the CFL and/or don't know what they're talking about. The Pro Football Hall of Fame is for NFLers only. Those points were made how many pages ago? And this whole debate degenerated into stupidity (sigh) seven or eight pages ago.
Click to expand...

And your point is ... ?

Do you want us to stop now, sir?

huntsie · Sep 7, 2006

shotglass said:

huntsie said:

We get it: Americans don't respect the CFL and/or don't know what they're talking about. The Pro Football Hall of Fame is for NFLers only. Those points were made how many pages ago? And this whole debate degenerated into stupidity (sigh) seven or eight pages ago.
Click to expand...

And your point is ... ?

Do you want us to stop now, sir?

It's just that the same points have been made a dozen times over. He's not getting into the Hall of Fame. Fine.
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JR · Sep 7, 2006

Huggy · Sep 7, 2006

JR said:

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I own that album. On vinyl.

Carry on.

JR · Sep 7, 2006

Huggy said:

JR said:

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I own that album. On vinyl.

Carry on.
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And why am I not surprised?

dooley_womack1 · Sep 7, 2006

Re: Does Damon Allen belong in the Football Hall of Fame? Marino says no Moon,

Lyman_Bostock said:

dooley_womack1 said:

Huggy said:

Lyman_Bostock said:

dooley_womack1 said:

And wasn't as good a wrestler as his dad, Rocky Johnson. The degrading things he and other pioneering black wrestlers like Rufus R. Jones and Bobo Brazil had to do to pave the way for Ron Simmons and the Rock.
Click to expand...

Bobo Brazil, "the world's greatest black wrestler." Brings back a lot of memories of TV wrestling on Sunday mornings. He did a TV ad for a grocery store in Chicago, on the south side, where, in very stilted acting, he'd buy "beer and chitlins by the case."

Wrestling was a lot more fun when the matches were held in TV studios and shown on UHF channels.
Click to expand...

Rocky Johnson was also a one-time sparring partner for a young George Foreman.

Bobo Brazil and the immortal Sweet Daddy Siki were also regulars on All Star Wrestling up here.
Click to expand...

Brazil's finishing move was the "cocoa headbutt." They gave him the name Bobo to make him sound like an ape, then gave him a finishing move that they gave almost all the black wrestlers, to imply that blacks had hard heads and weren't smart enough to apply the sleeper or the figure-four. And they always made Rocky Johnson say, "I came to stay, not to play," and have him do all kinds of "shuckin' and jivin," so the chitlins' ad is no surprise. The only old-school black wrestler they gave normal wrestling traits to was Ernie Ladd, cos he was entering wrestling after being famous in pro football, so he had an already-known personality, and leverage.

And Lyman, I hear you on the UHF and the studio shows. Wrestling at the Chase was appointment TV on Sunday mornings. I think the last vital studio show was the one in Memphis.
Click to expand...

"Time for Wrestling at the Chase! Call a friend!"

A buddy of mine was sitting at home one day when he got a call from a friend (not me), telling him "Wrestling at the Chase" was on TV. Behold the power of TV advertising.
Click to expand...

I gotta find this book:

God, Sam Muchnick was a munchkin (started out as a sports writer). The wrestler is either Black Angus or King Kong Brody. Larry Matysik was the play-by-play guy; Mickey Garagiola was the analyst.

rgd · Sep 7, 2006

It's anchor-MAN, not anchor-WOMAN!

Vic Mackey · Sep 8, 2006

That wrestler is Bruiser/King King Brody, tragically murdered in Puerto Rico.

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Does Damon Allen belong in the Football Hall of Fame? Marino says no Moon, yes

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Does Damon Allen belong in the Football Hall of Fame? Marino says no Moon, yes

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