Dark Knight discussions (**SPOILERS!!**)

I think his reaction to seeing Batman would have been the same whether he thought he was getting saved or not. I think Dent was a good guy (at least at that point) and really hoped she'd make it rather than him, even if he thought he was more likely to be saved.
And I'll see when I rewatch, but I don't think he knew Batman was going one place and the police another. He probably thought the cavalry was all going to Point A or Point B.

 

Continued from the other thread (since I don't want to post any spoilers there):

Initial thought: No one under 12 should see this movie. (We saw kids as young as 5 today. Holy fuck.) It's comparable on the violence, psychologically, to Reservoir Dogs -- and it was about as well done, cinematically. The "magic trick" ... damn, even the thought of it makes me cringe.

Initial thought P.S.: I'll never understand a world where a movie with this much violence is considered PG-13 ... but if one character had slipped in an F-bomb or one of Bruce Wayne's bombshells had shown a tit, it would have been rated R in the blink of an eye. I don't get it. That bothers me in a serious way.

Second thought: Joker, you sadistic fuck. ... Oh man, what a performance. I'm about as big a Heath Ledger fan as there is on this board, and I never once ... not once ... thought about the fact that he was the actor behind that creepy grin. He completely raised the bar. You knew he would steal the show, and he stole it anyway. Like the Ty Cobb of movie villains.

Negative thought: Maggie G. fit her role as assistant D.A. about as well as some of those bimbos they bring in on the new Law & Orders. Never thought I'd say it, but I wish Katie Holmes had returned -- she has the chops to work a serious courtroom and pull off the romantic-triangle stuff, too. Maggie was too flirty, never made me believe that she was a real ADA -- just like some of those young girls on Law & Order.

This and that: As others have said, Gordon is the most likable character in the movies. Well played. ... Caine and Freeman, again, were solid. Didn't try to carry their scenes, but were always an asset when they were on screen. ... Aaron Eckhart was good, he was. But I kept having flashbacks to "Thank You For Smoking;" his slick-talking D.A. bit was too similar to his slick-talking ciggie advocate. And I kept waiting, and waiting, and waiting for Harvey Dent to turn evil ... and they kept building, and building, and building him up into this White Knight hero ... that the effect was ruined when he finally (after too long) went bad. Just didn't work very well. ... Another thing that didn't work very well was the cell-phone/sonar shit at the end. The one in Hong Kong was pretty good. But the entire wall of images where Fox was checking on them? Kind of confusing. I didn't like it.

Final thought: Bale is growing on me -- he's the best Bruce Wayne there's ever been, but he's only above-average as Batman. ... Joker, though, makes this a classic. The hospital scene, the interrogation scene, the "magic trick" ... my god. Simply incredible.

 

The Joker knew of the connection between Batman and Rachel Dawes. He reversed the locations because he knew that Batman would go after Rachel and he wanted to hurt him in any way possible.


Now...for a question I pose to all of you that came out of a conversation I had tonight: Had Heath Ledger lived...had he not died and there had been a chance for the Joker to make another appearance in the sequel...would this thing had been as good as everyone said it was, hyped the way it is being hyped and taken in that much money in it's first weekend?

I say no.

 

I think the Ledger death created some curiosity, but I'm not sure how much that accounts for what's happening. I think his performance would still be getting every bit of the attention it's getting.

 

I was excited about this performance from the day I heard he was cast.
I know I saw at least makeup test shots if not full-done shots of him as the character that also had me excited before he died.
There may have even been a teaser trailer that gave us a taste.
So what I'm saying is, I have every reason to believe I'd be just as in love with his performance as I am now. In fact, I'd be thrilled to know he was be returning in the next one, because that sure looks like the plan based on the way this one ended for Joker.

 

It would have been better, if only for the fact that the final half-hour and Joker fate wouldn't have been so fucked up.

 

By the way, I saw so into the movie, I completely forgot it was even Ledger, much less that he was dead, while watching it.

 

In the fall, though. It's the Thanksgiving tentpole.

 

Agree with this. The ending's a mess. "Lesser" critics actually noticed this, whereas the bigger critics were enthralled with the nihilism and mood.

Good movie, but the high point is somewhere in the middle. Same deal with "Heat," too. Funny, how much Nolan ripped off from thay film. Good template...except for the ending.

 

I do agree the ending was the weakest part. That was surprising, because the Joker card ending with BB was great.
But it looked like a pretty clear setup for 3, with the return of Joker and who knows what else (Catwoman? Batman still on the run?).

 

Bale may be the most underrated guy out there.

Funny how three of the film's biggest stars were non-Americans deftly covering up their natural accents.

Three Americans couldn't pull that trick in reverse.

 

Similar, in my mind, to the two Aussies pulling off such great performances in "L.A. Confidential."

And speaking of that ... did you see the preview for the new Crowe/Di Caprio/Ridley Scott flick? Love all three of those guys, but damn, those accents were hideous.