C.C. Sabathia: Hall of Famer?

That was my thought as well. Sabathia is in the third year of a fairly steep decline, though part of that was being hurt much of 2014. I just don't see much in his career trends to show he can turn things around.

 

Buehrle is well ahead of CC in innings pitched and will probably beat him in wins. Felix Hernandez and Justin Verlander might beat him in KS

A lot of people thought Lincecum was a lock a few years ago, too. It's too early to say with Kershaw.

 

Two years ago I'd have said Verlander, but those two years have not been kind. Same with Adam Wainwright. The injuries will keep them from putting up the raw numbers you'd need to get in the discussion.
David Price seems like he could be on the right career track. Maybe Scherzer, if he puts together three or four good years before hitting the wall.
Madison Bumgarner is another one who seems to be on a HOF trajectory, even though he's got a lot of years ahead of him. He's already got 76 wins and 1,000 strikeouts at age 25, plus he's creating quite a legend as the best postseason pitcher of this generation. If he doesn't have any major injuries (a big if, considering he's already in his seventh season), he could be a 300-3,000 guy. Even if he doesn't quite get to those milestones, his postseason performances will bridge the gap.

 

Because he has never been that concerned with conditioning, he looks a lot older than he is. If he is done now, not HOF. He is a lefty though and has a cutter. If he stays somewhat healthy maybe he can reinvent himself like Frank Tanana. If he has 4-5 more decent seasons, like 15-10 with an average ERA, that may do it. If he is going to be a No. 5 guy on a good team and lose more than he wins, that won't do it.

 

Seems a bit early to say on Kershaw, but it is tough to argue with what he has done so far.

Not sure I'd lump Greinke and Sale together, just due to the age difference. Greinke is 31 and this is his ninth full season in the majors. Sale is 26 and in his fourth full season.

 

Let's let Kershaw get to 10 seasons first and then call him a lock. He's in Johan territory right now -- Such a great period but who knows if an injury is around the corner.

I think Felix is a lock. From a WAR standpoint, by the end of the season he should be in the top 100 for pitchers and he starts next season at 29. He's already top 70 in strikeouts and should be outside top 50 by end of the year. Just an average rest of his career should be more than enough.

I'm an established bigger Hall guy so I'd put Hudson and Sabathia in. I do agree that Buehrle and Hamels fall just short. I wish Buehrle would pitch until he's 40 just to see if he'd get past 250 wins and see how he's treated in the voting. Colon for me isn't close to a candidate. Far too many dead spots in his career.

Sale's definitely on the right starting trajectory but he's barely past 50 wins. Price is in the middle of the right trajectory but he's just under 100 wins and about to turn 30. Greinke will be a fascinating case. He's got three years left on his deal that will take him to 34. If he edges Scherzer to get a second Cy Young and pitches to late 30s, he should have the numbers pitching for a good team.

Wainwright has almost no shot because of his injuries. He'd have to pitch the way he has until he's 40 and avoid missing any more time. Verlander's got time to overcome the injuries -- even at 32. He's built enough of a base right now that he COULD get to 200-plus wins and 2,500 strikeouts. That MVP might hold a lot of weight.

 

Now 7-4, 3.32 ERA 1.28 WHIP, 106 K in 119 1/3 innings.

 

What the hell, why not, whatever.

 

Take a look at his career now.

 

There is this thread

CC Sabathia: Hall of Famer?

But to update the point:

he's 17th in strikeouts (47 from 3,000)
he 35th in games started (19 from 550)
he's 55th in wins (6 from 250)
he's 80th in innings pitched (44 from 3,500)
he's tied for 53rd in pitcher WAR at 61.5 (.5 WAR from the top 50)

 

Better than Mussina, Pettitte, Kaat, Tommy John, Dennis Martinez?

 

For WAR, the order is

23. Mussina
48. John
t53. Sabathia
t60. Pettitte
107. Martinez
131. Kaat

If it was me, I'd put all of them in except for Martinez. Kaat sneaks over based on the fielding.

My order is Mussina, Sabathia, Pettitte, John, Kaat, Martinez