Baseball Hall of Fame, Class of '08

Some thoughts...

1. Jack Morris belongs in the HOF far more than Blyleven. In the 1980s, Jack Morris was the guy you wanted on the mound in a big game. The number that hurts him is his ERA, but that can be explained because for most of his career, he pitched in Tiger Stadium, a hitters park. Also, he would go deep into games and get a lot of complete games. But the biggest thing is that he was a clutch pitcher.

2. You know, with Harold Baines, the "Hall of Fame" light doesn't go on in my head. He was a complete one-dimesional player, but it was the important dimension. He had over 2,800 hits, and you can't dismiss that. I think you could make an argument that he was a better hitter than Wade Boggs, although I detest the "If Player X is in, then Player Y has to be in" because that leads to undeserving HOF members.

3. I have been a proponent of a Hall of Fame ejection election. There are some obvious players who have no business in the HOF - Rabbit Maranville, a .255 hitter during an offensive era; Roger Breshnahan, noted for invented shin guards are the most obvious who come to mind.

4. I was disappointed with the Veterans Committee allowing Walter O'Malley and Barney Dreyfus in. Owners generally shouldn't be in Hall of Fames - there are some exceptions if they build a sport. Marvin Miller belongs in the Hall of Fame because of his impact on baseball.

 

Hal Baines is a very tough call, but the guy was an awesome hitter.

 

Does Morris' ERA need to be looked at again because of the pumped up hitters?

 

And I wonder why it took you less than a second to check off Murphy's name. ...

Seriously, though, for about eight years, Murphy was one of the best in the National League, so I've got no issue with his ballot being cast. But I don't think he ever sees the Hall. Especially with the offensive numbers increasing today, it's not looking for good for a player with 398 homers.

Murphy is one of only five players to ever grab consecutive NL MVPs -- Bonds did it twice -- and that's something that is generally overlooked in debates I've had about him.

 

Gossage and McGwire.

If Sutter's in, Gossage should be too.

McGwire was likely headed to the Hall of Fame even before the '98 season, and although his bout before Congress was pathetic, he never tested positive for steroids. And I don't think you can penalize players for using substances that Major League Baseball never outlawed at the time. He played within the rules at the time, he was one of the greatest players of his era and he should be in the Hall of Fame.

Same goes for Bonds and Sosa. Only shoo-in slugger from the 90s who wouldn't get my vote is Raffy Palmeiro.

The rest of the players on that list — Blyleven, Morris, Dawson, Rice, Murphy — were great players. But the Hall of Fame isn't for everybody. Only the elite. Longevity really helped pad some of those guys's numbers, IMO.

 

McGwire hit nearly 200 homers from 1998 onward and raised his career BA. Before then he probably had 380 homers and was a career .250 hitter. So I don't think you can say he was "headed to the HOF anyway."

The "steroids weren't against the rules" meme is useless.

 

One other thought. Dave Parker was a lot better player than Jim Rice. Better hitter who played in parks which were not hitters parks. Better defensively. And far more feared during his playing days.

 

How can longevity help pad someone's numbers?

How does that thought process develop in someone's mind?

"You know, that guy's numbers are only good because he stayed in the big leagues for 20 years."

What the fuck?

Gold -- that isn't a bad point about Parker.

 

You could bring Cal Ripken, Jr. into the conversation with how he padded his consecutive games mark by staying in the league longer than needed, even when he was hurting the Orioles.

 

Hank Aaron clearly padded his numbers by staying in the league, too.

 

Bert Blyleven was in no way shape or form dominant. Hitters took him over the fence as if they were sailors at the dock and he was manning the glory hole. His career marks were due to hanging in with mediocre numbers adding up. Surely you're not saying he's twice as worthy as Sandy Koufax, based on places on the career stats list. He in no way shape or form helped define his era. He will not ever make the Hall of Fame, nor should he, the stamping of your feets notwithstanding.

And McGwire's numbers are McGwire's numbers. I have no way to quantify how much andro (and perhaps steroids) may have helped him, and I don't know how many times juiced pitchers got him out instead of grooving one to him. So for the purposes of Hall voting, I take his numbers at face value. And defined his era? In spades.

 

Parker's career numbers are a lot better than I thought they were. He, like Rice, is the definition of a borderline candidate.