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All-purpose open-wheel (F1, IRL) racing thread

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by crimsonace, Feb 19, 2007.

  1. bigpern23

    bigpern23 Well-Known Member

    Bummer to see both Scuderia retired, but there was lots of good racing action throughout Sunday’s Grand Prix in Azerbaijan. One of the better races of the season.
     
  2. Azrael

    Azrael Well-Known Member

    Maybe Indy needs to go back into its own history to liven things up:

    c4fb09253d52445c84c1351c1e6e8819.png 118994103_940466519766491_3439311375532625954_.jpeg 482a1a90cba0e3cee3a1ff0e767bb14a.jpg 1-imsc0299.jpeg imsc5118.jpg 4e48d0170f2e7316e9e741ee79c98f1d.jpg 09_Classic_Sports_Car_Indy_500_Strange_Cars.png 20_6.jpg 1982-637-a.jpeg
     
    maumann likes this.
  3. maumann

    maumann Well-Known Member

    Recently read a great feature on the history of that last car in your series of photos. It was constructed in Idaho by a guy who custom-built airplanes but it was never wind tunnel tested or even driven at speed before showing up at Indy. In fact, some of it was manufactured out of aircraft plywood.

    Davey Hamilton's dad tried to drive it and the thing was so unstable because the four wing fairings created different centers of pressure, he couldn't even get it up to rookie orientation speed without being on the verge of crashing.

    The Sumar Special was incredibly futuristic but had one major problem: the plastic bubble nearly suffocated the driver because there was no airflow inside the cockpit. The chief mechanic eventually removed it. The new aeroscreens have a similar issue, especially on hot days. At least today's helmets have cooling ducts attached.

    And yeah, unfortunately the Sears Allstate Special with Dave MacDonald in 1964 is a sad reminder that safety many times plays second-fiddle to innovation. The 1973 race was a perfect storm of technology outstripping the ability to keep drivers safe. Massive horsepower and massive wings attached to relatively flimsy aerocraft aluminum bodywork pushing speeds close to 200 mph, while carrying 75 gallons of fuel.
     
  4. maumann

    maumann Well-Known Member

    Fred Offenhauser and Harry Miller built this car (nicknamed the Golden Submarine) for Barney Oldfield. It not only had a roof but an enclosed rollcage in an effort to keep drivers from being killed in rollover accidents. It ran in the 1919 500 but retired with engine issues.

    [​IMG]
     
  5. Azrael

    Azrael Well-Known Member


    I think an answer for boring racing across so many of these series would be standardized safety rules - but wide-open engineering, performance and design rules. The anti-IROC.

    Especially when you roll hybrid-electric into the mix:

    600041ebe9250.jpg
     
    maumann likes this.
  6. maumann

    maumann Well-Known Member

    Dallara wants the honor of being the sole chassis supplier, since the damn things cost $350,000 (and IndyCar wants parity). I get that.

    But there are a lot of smart engineers with 3D printers that can make relatively cheap pieces. I really don't understand why IndyCar doesn't mandate a common tub/aeroscreen and engine spec, and let each team create whatever bodywork/wings/ground effects they want. At least then there'd be some unique designs and maybe some separation in competition.

    If say, Andretti finds something, they ought to be allowed to have an advantage until Ganassi or Penske or Arrow/McLaren figure it out as well. I get that the smaller teams and the one-offs would be at a serious disadvantage, but how is that much different now?

    One radical change I'd make is the elimination of a full-track caution, unless the situation is so serious that it warrants a red flag. I saw that at the 24 Hours of Le Mans and was very impressed. The Speedway is 2 1/2 miles long, and throwing a yellow is an artificial way of bunching up the field to create competition.

    For example, if there's a crash in Turn 2, race officials should be able to turn on the local yellow in the south shortchute until the cars reach the backstretch, and mandate a 60 mph limit in that section. Every team has two spotters who could immediately relay that information (or it could show on the steering wheel dashboard).

    In fact, IndyCar might even be able to remotely access each cars' pit road speed limiter to make sure nobody's cheating.

    That would allow the cars to race where the track is clear (and pit if need be) without bunching the field behind the pace car. That was the norm until the 1970s, when the PACER lights were adopted, followed by the bunch-up rule.

    That also removes the danger of having 30-plus cars pit at the same time AND ugly-ass, dangerous restarts. And it would remove some of the NASCARification from the sport.

    The new 2024 engines are supposed to create more HP, which might force more drivers to lift in the corners, but I'm concerned that if everyone has the same power band, nothing will significantly change. Right now, everybody tunes to the limits of the aero kit, and as Pato O'Ward lamented on that last restart, he had the thing trimmed out and the pedal to the floor and still couldn't pass Ericsson.

    I don't give a shit whether Chevy thinks Honda has an advantage or the other way around. That's why you have engineers and designers looking for an edge. Otherwise, you're just NASCAR without fenders.
     
    Last edited: Jun 14, 2022
    franticscribe and Azrael like this.
  7. 2muchcoffeeman

    2muchcoffeeman Well-Known Member

    OK, hold on. We’re gonna whoa it down from 240 to 60 just (snaps fingers) like that?
     
  8. UPChip

    UPChip Well-Known Member

    I wonder if there is a way for IndyCar, and (probably harder) Indy to do the Virtual Safety Car.
     
  9. playthrough

    playthrough Moderator Staff Member

    I was in the Indy airport this morning and one of those STP "wedge" cars was on display. It's always more interesting to see the museum cars in the concourses rather than a current race car in the main atrium.
     
    Neutral Corner and maumann like this.
  10. Typist Clerk

    Typist Clerk Active Member

    I’d stick with the full-track caution but eliminate closing the pits at the start of one. Where you are regarding your pit window is the luck of the draw.

    Doing that would also allow eliminating the wave-around. Again, luck of the draw.

    It also allows a faster return to green. And no more yellow extensions for cleaning the track of clag.
     
  11. Neutral Corner

    Neutral Corner Well-Known Member

  12. PCLoadLetter

    PCLoadLetter Well-Known Member

    Two things of note on this...

    1) Piquet has been universally hated in the paddock since his driving days. I'm not sure there has been another driver that people disliked on that level, which is a big reason why you never hear him on any list of great drivers... despite being a three-time world champ.

    2) Piquet's daughter is Max Verstappen's girlfriend.
     
    Neutral Corner and franticscribe like this.
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