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Aaaaand Duke Settles...

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by westcoastvol, Jun 18, 2007.

  1. Pastor

    Pastor Active Member

    Not at all. It isn't the job of the university to protect these kids. The job of a university is to educate students.

    So, what you are saying is that the school should have started backing these students from the get go even when there was a possibility that they were guilty. And if it turned out that the students were guilty, people would be screaming about Duke trying to protect rapists.

    That is all fine and well with your neighbor. In the end, it is his choice. Duke wants money, just like all universities. Now it is feeling the effects of jumping the gun a bit early. But given the evidence at the time, they must have felt the need to act expeditiously.

    I'm looking at them in terms of whether or not they are grounds for a lawsuit. And thus far, the university hasn't exactly done anything to warrant the pay-out.

    So, by not backing up the students they were tearing them down? Sorry, but that doesn't fly. The school bounced the kids. By all accounts there was a history of this. Throw in the email from one player with inflamatory language, it wasn't like the university wasn't granted cause.

    Again, not really. Cases are settled all of the time. When you factor in the expense of going to trial, the lawyer fees, the research fees, years in the news, etc, etc, sometimes it's just prudent to give a cash hand-out and be done with it.

    At least be honest. I have NEVER defended Nifong in this. I have kept this solely on Duke University and their responsibility.
  2. Pancamo

    Pancamo Active Member

    Brought this upon themselves? What if the stripper was actually raped would you have said she brought it upon herself because she was a stripper and never should have been in that situation?
  3. leo1

    leo1 Active Member

    this whole thing fucking stinks. all of it. even the settlement. like webster said, nothing listed here on this thread amounts to a cause of action. no one, not even a rich private school, throws money (unless it's a small settlement) at problems just because they were mean to the kids.

    i haven't read 'it's not about the truth' and i have no plans to so my knowledge of the book is based solely on the commentary i heard on the radio but it sounds like the book stinks, too. blaming the stripper for all of this, calling her one step above a crack ho, doesn't exactly shed light on anything.
  4. dooley_womack1

    dooley_womack1 Well-Known Member

    What kind of sophistry are you trying to pull off here? There are tons of private colleges that would have booted those kids, no questions asked, for moral turpitude. Doesn't matter if they were perhaps engaging in a legal activity (tho I bet there were a few underage drinkers there). A private university can set up its own things to enforce (as long as they're not racially or gender suspect categories, and even Bob Jones pushes that). There is no legal right to go to a private university. The stripper was doing a legal activity. Duke has every right to say that what the little darlings did, even if it's legal, is against its rules. Again, sometimes its just easier to settle, even if there's no moral reason for you to.
  5. JackyJackBN

    JackyJackBN Guest

    This thread is a great reflection of why Nifong sold those kids down the river. He took a political stance, assumed (rightly) that the majority of constituents would agree with him, threw the justice system out the window and did what it took to get elected. It backfired.

    I've spoken repeatedly with a (recent) former President of the Duke Alumni Association. He's appalled by all concerned, but most of all by the 88 profs, because they are supposed to be a source of wisdom. Instead they inflamed an already rotten situation with political rhetoric. In his estimation, the school comes in a close second.

  6. D-3 Fan

    D-3 Fan Well-Known Member

    dools, they did hire a stripper and acted like asses, but under no circumstances that the whole entire team can get screwed in the manner than Nifong did. Are "those kids" guilty of stupidity and long-term childishness? Hell yeah. But that doesn't hold a jock to what Nifong single-handedly did: use his elected position as a means to get votes for reelection by inciting class, race, and the different worlds between Duke and Durham by taking a group of students (they're not fucking kids when you look at it. They are young adults) and prosecuting them without using the ethical principles that are important when doing his job.

    Don't stop at those kids. Look at the entire campus of Duke. Middle to Upper Class white and black parents send their kids there. How many of those kids head into Durham? How many of the townies set foot on the campus? That's what I thought. Not many on both sides.

    In most communities with a campus, the townies hate the students, the faculty, and the campus in general. Why? Because the campus is not "like" them. Just a bunch of brats, the intelligencistas and stuck-up ness of the faculty, and that the campus gets more publicity and love than the town itself.

    Back to your contention to conclude this post, most schools would expel or suspend them, but you continue to forget the one caveat of this matter: it's Duke fucking University. Duke is going to do it in their own "special" way. The smart money then was to expel or suspend them. Brodhead and Company waffled around and then hung them out to dry without any strong evidence. The administration took away their season, and in turn, that team was shamed (and deservedly so to a point in which they ceased and desist from doing anything silly from that point on. Remember that last line: when was the last time anyone on that team did anything wrong after the summer of 2006?

    It is the stripper's right to perform, but she also has to take the verbiage from the crowd as well. She's gotten as much negative shit thrown her way at the club as she does at private parties.

    I said this before and damnmit I'll say it again: those players are not angels and we're not here to lionize them, as you suggest. They messed up royally and they will continue to pay the price. Nifong got his on Saturday. When will Duke get theirs handed to them?

    Sophistry? What the fuck? This "ain't" Masterpiece Theatre. Talk in regular English. ;)
  7. dog428

    dog428 Active Member

    They don't have to back them up, but they can't pile on either. And that's what the school did. I don't care how many times the university has suspended a student for hiring a stripper, it was still an unusual occurrence on the Duke campus. As was cancelling the season, firing the coach and passing around the petition. (And sorry, when 80-something of your employees do something, you're responsible. Every. Single. Time.)

    Those out-of-the-ordinary actions presented a clear, easy-to-understand opinion of the university -- we believe these kids have done something very bad. Defamation of character isn't limited to just words. Actions can cause just as much harm.
  8. dooley_womack1

    dooley_womack1 Well-Known Member

    The point is, Duke had no legal obligation to be "fair." Paying a settlement is more than they were obligated to do.
  9. slappy4428

    slappy4428 Active Member

    And yet, no jury in the world wouldn't rule in their favor...

    Be nice if the kiddies took a page out of the Richard Jewell playbook on this and started going out after slander and libel... be nice to see Jesse and Al squirm, although the latter doesn't exactly pay those verdicts off quickly.
  10. Pastor

    Pastor Active Member

    And none of what you just mentioned is grounds for a lawsuit. That is where I have stood on this. That is why I have no idea why these students even went after Duke in the first place. (The professors don't represent Duke's opinions, they represent their own.)

    I would have no qualms if the students decided to go after Sharpton and Jackson. I wouldn't have a problem if they went after Nifong. I just don't understand the lawsuit against Duke.
  11. Webster

    Webster Well-Known Member

    But they would never get to a jury. Based on the facts that we know, they don't have a case against Duke.

    The school settled for two reasons. First, and most importantly, to end this story. Second, so as not to pay high six figures in attorneys fees to get this case thrown out. Even lawyers in NC cost upwards of $400/hr.
  12. bomani jones

    bomani jones Member

    This is the ad from the 88 - http://listening.nfshost.com/listening.htm

    Could someone show me what in this was libelous or slanderous? The best I can guess is the line, "These students are shouting and whispering about what happened to this young woman and to themselves." But, as a resident of Durham that knows quite a few Duke students, I can tell you that's exactly what many students were talking about.
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