2012 Baseball HOF ballot

Raines was truly a superstar in the 1980s. He was an above-average LF at best in the 1990s, missing time with injuries, bouncing from team to team.

Raines was a natural leadoff hitter, but he was moved out of the leadoff role in the late 80s by the Expos. This caused Raines' stolen bases to drop somewhat, although some of that was a function of wear and tear. Bill James suggested that the change in lineup position was one that was confusing to Raines, and one that did not take maximum advantage of his talents.

Had Raines not bounced from team to team, and had he not left the leadoff role, Raines would have been remembered as the greatest leadoff hitter in the history of the NL. Raines missed Lou Brock's SB record by 130 steals; had he stayed in the NL his entire career and stayed in the leadoff position, he may well have broken Brock's NL record for career steals. That would have given him a huge talking point to go with his stats that only sabermetric types seem to love. It also would have taken him out of Rickey Henderson's shadow to some degree.

Indeed, much of Raines' problem with the HOF voters is that he played in the same era as Henderson, was the same type of player as Henderson, yet Henderson has held so many important records, while Raines holds none.

Larkin's an easy Hall of Famer. He hit like a Hall of Fame shortstop, so that should be good enough, but he was also a terrific fielder and baserunner. He was the very definition of a complete, high percentage player. He has the numbers of a Hall of Famer, but furthermore, he passes the test of the emphasis on the "Fame" part. Larkin was regarded as a genuine superstar in his day. It would be sheer absurdity to keep him out.

In my book, if Edgar had contributed a little more with the glove he'd move from just shy of the mark to just over it. I'm not going to be bent out of shape whether he gets in or stays out.

Bagwell played for a small media team, never had any career milestones that people pay attention to, never had any october memories, never had any "WOW" seasonal stats, was pretty much never the best player at his position during his career, and had a relatively short career for somebody who is supposed to be an elite player.

Yeah, Bagwell is somebody that during his prime you think will be a HoF'er but then the guy doesn't play for 20+ years and get those milestone numbers like you expected him to during his prime. I think before steroids popped up he would have had a not so easy time getting in. Now though I say his chances might have improved.

 

Larkin was regarded as an exceptional player. He wasn't a "superstar" in the sense of hype, but any list of the 10 best players in the NL at that time had him on it.

 

Bagwell didn't have wow seasons? You must have a very small HOF.

 

That was my thought upon reading his post, too. That, and Gehrig is badly underestimating how good Bagwell was in his prime.

 

Frank Thomas belongs on the first ballot. Maybe more "slugger in the steroid era" bullshit gets in the way, but it shouldn't.

 

Kent's numbers are pretty wild compared with other second baseman -- he and Rogers Hornsby are the only two to have 120 RBIs in multiple seasons. An MVP award (a B.S. one but he did get it) and four top-10 finishes too.

Being enough of a dickhead to make Barry Bonds a sympathetic figure is probably what will hurt him most.

 

I'd vote for both of those.

 

Before his dad died and before his physical issues became chronic, Thomas was one of the twelve greatest pure hitters in the history of baseball.

 

I also think that Frank Thomas and Pedro Martinez are near-certain first-ballot guys.

Bernie Williams does not have a great case. None of his career numbers scream HoF, and playing on great teams doesn't automatically make you a Hall player. He had eight very good seasons, but he never finished higher than seventh in the MVP voting.

Raines should be in the Hall, but he's not Rickey Henderson. That's not the comparison anybody should make. Gehrig made a good case for Raines, although he sold Bagwell a little short.

As for Jack Morris, I don't see it. Another very good player who won some big games, but his career numbers do not stack up.