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18-YO Black Teens Beat White Teen Because They "Were Mad Over Trevon Martin"

Discussion in 'Sports and News' started by BNWriter, Apr 26, 2012.

  1. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    It's the premeditation that makes it a murder. Otherwise it's some other form of homicide.
     
  2. Azrael

    Azrael Well-Known Member

    The point is that we already take 'thought' into consideration when fashioning laws and punishments.
     
  3. Beaker

    Beaker Active Member

    Criminal law doesn't exist in a moral vacuum. The law makes judgments about what crimes are worse, and that includes considerations of motivation or "thought."
     
  4. YGBFKM

    YGBFKM Guest

    Crimes that fit nicely into a social/political/ideological narrative are the most heinous. All others are not very important.
     
  5. dixiehack

    dixiehack Well-Known Member

    We can reasonably infer premeditation. (or lack of same) from the actions taken by the accused. Little trickier to affirm "feelings" that trigger actions taken prior yo commission of the crime.
     
  6. doctorquant

    doctorquant Well-Known Member

    The point is that you are guilty of murder if you are guilty of murder, which implies the whole "malice aforethought" bit. That is, if you went to your cupboard, pulled out a pistol, loaded it, stuck it into your waistband, then drove across town and confronted and then shot this guy who'd been effing you over, it's pretty obvious it wasn't a crime of passion and coincidence. So, yes, mindset plays a role. But that's a non-sequiter in this issue, because mindset's frequently a consideration in criminal cases (c.f., perjury).

    On the other hand, if you'd done all the above so you could knock off some guy of a race other than yours because, in part, he's of a race other than yours, you'd still be guilty of murder, but you'd also be guilty of a hate crime. We'd just be punishing you -- assuming we did -- because, somehow, we feel there are some reasons to commit murder that are worse than others. But that's ridiculous, because we've said all along that you can't commit murder. It's like saying, "OK, this guy's a murderer, but he's also a racist!" Who gives a rat's patootie? He's a murderer!
     
  7. franticscribe

    franticscribe Well-Known Member

    Premeditation is the difference between first- and second-degree murder, not murder and other forms of homicide.

    And the point that homicide law in particular focuses on the mens rea (state of mind) of the defendant at the time of the crime is an apt analogy to the justification behind elevating one form of assault over another based on the defendant's state of mind at the time of the assault.
     
  8. Dick Whitman

    Dick Whitman Well-Known Member

    I've always thought it odd that the brutality of a murder helps make it first-degree murder instead of second-degree or manslaughter.

    Seems to me like a crime committed in anger or spur of the moment would be more likely, not less, to be brutal. And that a premeditated murder would be more likely to be clean and quick.
     
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