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"The Force Awakens" (with SPOILERS)

Discussion in 'Anything goes' started by Dick Whitman, Dec 18, 2015.

  1. bigpern23

    bigpern23 Well-Known Member

    Point taken, but at least they have stories to tell. There is no more story to be told about Darth Vader.
     
  2. Batman

    Batman Well-Known Member

    I think the answer to the first question is that Vader assumed his kids were dead (after all, that's what the Emperor himself told him) and he probably didn't spend a lot of time searching for him until after the Death Star blew up.
    Plus, Tatooine was a bit out of the way, somewhat disorganized as far as government, and generally beneath the Empire's concern. It seemed like the Empire wouldn't go there unless they had a reason to, and was generally content to leave it to the scum and smugglers. The droids landing there with the Death Star plans finally gave them a reason to go there. Owen and Beru weren't killed because they were hiding Luke, they were killed because they'd crossed paths with the droids.

    As for the grudge, maybe Owen -- like a lot of people in the galaxy -- would have known of Anakin's betrayal of the Jedi, but not known that Luke was Anakin's kid. Obi-Wan could have just told him some lie or half-truth about him being an orphan and maybe even used the Jedi mind trick to make him believe it. And then, somehow, Owen finds out the truth and realizes what it could mean if Vader and the Empire find out as well. Then you have Owen pissed that not only did Obi-Wan lie to him, he duped him as well.
    Either that, or Obi-Wan sold him a used speeder that broke down three days later.
     
  3. Batman

    Batman Well-Known Member

    I don't know that Vader would work as a movie -- we've already had six of them centered around him -- but if they ever decide to branch out into TV it could be great.
    We know that Vader was essentially the Empire's version of a mob cleaner. They called him in to gain control of big situations that were getting out of hand, or to undertake high-level special missions. That's a fertile ground from which to mine great action and intrigue stories, and they don't even need to necessarily tie into the bigger Star Wars universe. Considering we have about 20 years between ROTS and Rogue One/ANH, a mission he undergoes halfway between those films would likely have no bearing on larger events later on.
     
  4. bigpern23

    bigpern23 Well-Known Member

    Again, that's fanboi masturbation. It's showing us Vader for Vader's sake, not telling us a real story about him, or filling in any of the story of the Galactic Civil War. "Next week, Vader wipes out a Rebel base on Jackoffar!" Who cares?

    The idea of the anthology series is to explore the Star Wars Universe. There is simply nothing left to explore with Vader. His character has been explored, his story told.
     
    sgreenwell likes this.
  5. Batman

    Batman Well-Known Member

    I get where you're going in the bigger scope of things. We know his beginning and his end, intimately. Where you mine the stories from is the part of his life that made him the most feared badass in the galaxy -- and I'm not just talking about the events of ROTS.
    At the end of that movie, to the galaxy at large, Anakin Skywalker was a Jedi traitor but he was also a dead Jedi traitor. What, in the 20 years between films, made the reborn Darth Vader such an instantly recognizable source of terror?
    As soon as those rebels in Rogue One saw him in the corridor they knew they were in deep shit, and they knew why. If all Anakin had done to make his reputation had been playing a relatively small role in wiping out the Jedi a generation earlier -- the Clones and the Emperor did the heavy lifting with Order 66; Anakin's biggest contribution was killing a temple full of kids -- he'd be remembered with disgust, not feared as an ongoing mortal threat. So Vader must have done a lot in those 20 years to be both a legend whose reputation preceded him AND someone who was recognizable enough for people to know him when they see him.

    So, yeah, it is fanboi masturbation. I'll admit that. But a lot of shows and movies have been based off the same premise. The first one coming to my mind is "Better Call Saul," which is pretty engrossing. As with anything. it's all in the execution. Treat it like the books, where we get some side characters that rise to the level of the Empire's notice and show Vader dealing with them. That can take a single episode or be a multi-layered arc with some intrigue and bigger themes.
    And, even though it doesn't have to tie into either trilogy directly, it still lets you expand the Star Wars universe by introducing characters or sneaking known ones into scenes, and showing the evolution of the Empire over that 20-year period between the two trilogies.
     
  6. bigpern23

    bigpern23 Well-Known Member

    But doesn't that just become a series about Vader slaughtering people? If you're making him the center of this show, you're asking the audience to root for him, and you're asking them to root for him to slaughter people. Since his redemption occurs in the films, there's nowhere for the character to go. It's just episode after episode of Vader accruing kills to cement the reputation we already know he has. Why bother?
     
  7. Bradley Guire

    Bradley Guire Well-Known Member

    Don't worry about whether the Kenobi novel is cannon. What it is, is shit. He's practically a side character in his own novel. We learn more about random Tattooine rednecks, and good gravy a sand person gets a storyline.
     
  8. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    There are already two television series that tell part of Vader's story and they are canon, but they are also animated.

    The Clone Wars focused heavily on Anakin. He is a side character in Rebels, but still part of the story.
     
  9. Starman

    Starman Well-Known Member

    Obi-Wan had never met Owen and Beru until literally he shows up on the doorstep with Luke in his hands.

    For that matter Owen and Beru had only met Anakin and Padme very briefly several years before, and that visit ended up with Owen's stepmother Shmi dead and Anakin and Padme zooming off into the galaxy.

    However Owen did have to notice that the local infestation of the Sand People dropped dramatically after Anakins visit. Plus I'd guess word got around among the Sand People, "Don't Fuck with the Lars Ranch."
     
  10. Batman

    Batman Well-Known Member

    Because the journey and the action can be fun?
    It's like a horror movie. You know the teenagers at the camp are going to be slaughtered by Jason Voorhees, but you watch it anyone to see how it all unfolds. Plus, if you do want to tie it into the movies, you can show the scheming between Vader and the Emperor over a number of years and fill in the cracks of Vader's journey back toward the light.
    It's not a perfect concept, but it could work better than a lot of other Star Wars spinoff ideas.
     
  11. Batman

    Batman Well-Known Member

  12. outofplace

    outofplace Well-Known Member

    The Darth Vader comic book is one thing that inspired some of the desire for a movie about Vader. It has touched on some of the things you mentioned, including moments where the decency in him threatens to show itself. Still, you've got a villain whose face you never see, so the supporting cast would have to add something to make any movie work, even if he ends up wiping most of them out by the end of the movie.
     
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