We have to go back! (Lost 2009 season)

[RickStain]

How is that not a cliffhanger?  The shot cut out the moment we were about to have the information revealed that would solve the major question of the season: Can time be changed?

The first episode of next season should solve it.

If the H-bomb was always part of the incident, as Miles pointed out, then nothing was changed.  I'm guessing part of the Incident was to send the Losties back to 2007 where they belong and we move on into the future, the perpetual time loop having repeated itself.  (This is what I think will happen).

If the H-bomb was a change in the incident, then we'll find out that things have been changed in the future.

It was intentionally ambiguous.

[jps]

Anyone know if you can rent full seasons at places like Blockbuster and Movie Gallery?

They break up the sets so you rent each disc individually, but yeah.  That's how Mrs. Circus and I got into the show.

Awesome.

After watching the finale tonight, and see how hooked my boss is on the show, I realized I've got to get caught up.

I've got what, seven months or so before next season starts? I figure I can get caught up in that time.

Oh, most definitely.  Sucks that you're not watching them in order, but you've crossed that bridge.  Get thee to the video store!

ky, we've got them through season 4 at our place. we just recently got season 4 -- it's still a 3-day rental.

[CentralIllinoisan]

I agree with Doc: Juliet's choice was VERY important, and Jacob not visiting her was very key; he doesn't realize the role she is to play in the detonating of the bomb.

Jacob's presence in the flashbacks, I think, is not to bring good, but to save himself in the future.

Did it work? I don't think so.

[I Digress]

Maybe. If the bomb reset everything, then the 'other' god or whatever can't masquerade as Locke because Locke doesn't come to the island. Or maybe Jacob knew what the 'other' was doing and wanted to make sure the bomb reset stuff because he wants the plane crash folk to have another go around at the game if they really are locked in a time loop.
There was a Juliet flashback. Jacob didn't appear in that? I forget. Maybe he didn't need to touch her because she was on the island. Don't forget, Richard wooed Juliet to the island.

[DanOregon]

I guess one of the things that frustrates me is that I'm certain the first few episodes will be backstory before revealing the after-effects of the blast. Lost has always worked that way. Probably focusing on Jacob and anti-Jacob, maybe throw in some Faraday, Claire and Widmore stuff, maybe even the retired couple, as well. And the reveal will come at the end of an episode that will seem like a flashback, then we will see the reveal that it wasn't a flashback at the end. Twenty-two hours left, at the same time it seems like too much time and not enough time to wrap everything up.

[RickStain]

I guess one of the things that frustrates me is that I'm certain the first few episodes will be backstory before revealing the after-effects of the blast. Lost has always worked that way. Probably focusing on Jacob and anti-Jacob, maybe throw in some Faraday, Claire and Widmore stuff, maybe even the retired couple, as well. And the reveal will come at the end of an episode that will seem like a flashback, then we will see the reveal that it wasn't a flashback at the end. Twenty-two hours left, at the same time it seems like too much time and not enough time to wrap everything up.

I think there's only 17 hours left.

And actually, when you count in commercial breaks, there's a little less than 12 hours of screen time left.

[Piotr Rasputin]

The Hanso Foundation "funds all this shit." Dharma HQ is in Ann Arbor. My wife noted that it would be a funny twist if Widmore was Hanso during his many off-Island excursions before he was banished.

After Season One, I said: "OK, now they go down the hatch, and I guess the boat dudes were Others?"

After Season Two, I said, "OK, Penny's on her way, the leaders are captured, Hurley will bring help . . . is Locke/Desmond/Eko dead?

After Season Three, I said, "OK, now we'll see them get off the island, and then have to come back."

After Season Four, I said, "OK, the island is moved. What does that mean? Locke is dead. What the heck? We'll find out soon enough."

After last night . . . . I have no idea what happens next. I had hoped Jack would drop the bomb down the shaft, then white light, then the next shot is Oceanic 815 landing at LAX. But no, we get no hints, no clues. Just a hell of a lot of anticipation.

Of all the theories so far, I like Batman's the best. A couple of thoughts:

- Kind of figured the "What Lies in the Shadow of the Statue?" crowd were religious fanatics. Still, would have liked them to be modern Dharma. Would still like to know what happened in Ann Arbor after the Purge.
- Jacob and Evil Dude (Esau, perhaps?) are in a War of the Gods. Two nigh-immortal beings, living in a paradise, albeit a quirky one. Jacob keeps bringing people to the Island because he believes in the inherent goodness of humanity, and thinks having outsiders come to the Island with increasingly modern ideas can only represent "progress." Which to him, is learning about what people are doing on the mainland. He is fascinated by "normal" people and their potential for good.
- Evil Dude (Yeah, I'll call him Esau) doesn't believe in humanity. He wants paradise to remain undisturbed. It frustrates him to no end that Jacob keeps bringing people there. And by the time of the Black Rock's arrival, they've been playing this game for centuries, and his frustration is boiling over.
- Jacob knew the whole war would come to a head when he finished the tapestry. And I agree, he left clues on it for his followers to use. Like Faraday leaving his journal with the bomb instructions.
- "They're coming" referred to Jacob's followers approaching the room with blood on their minds, looking to get some answers as to who this new John Locke is.
- I think NDub is right: Lapidus is a candidate to be a vessel for Jacob.
- I'm wondering who will be on Evil Dude's (Esau) side. What kind of army would he have? What kind of army would he need?
- Liked the depiction of Jacob as an ethereal figure who visited everyone at pivotal moments in their lives to help, give advice, tell them to buck up and get through their challenges. I'm not sure if he was doing it as a time traveler, or in real time because he knew their destinies would bring them back to the Island. Or perhaps he was building a network of followers. (Loved seeing young Jack's disaster surgery depicted).
- I wondered if they had cut Jacob's visit from Juliet's flashback, or if they meant to be clear that he had not visited her at what was a pivotal moment.
- His visit to Sayid was different. Sayid was with Nadia, perfectly happy to leave the Island behind. And her death was what got him involved again, via Ben Linus recruiting him to be an assassin.
- Really liked how Ben was loyal to the Island the whole time, and finally couldn't handle anymore that he never met Jacob. Ben was never meant to be the special leader of the Others . . . and I'm not sure Widmore was either. They were all placeholders for John Locke, whose fatal flaws (dependence on a father figure, lack of belief in himself) meant that he took a lot of time getting to the Island. And then he committed the fatal mistake of trusting Ben Linus, because he sought both counsel and reassurance from this king of lies.
- A thousand things could happen now in the wake of the blast. But I will say that I don't think the bomb caused the Incident, because the bomb went off after all hell had already broken loose. The Swan video said that following the Incident, they had to cap the electromagnetic energy by pressing the button. So the Incident was really the drill going too deep, and the whole mechanism collapsing into the well. Radzinsky's actions, and Chang being unable to prevent them, caused the Incident as it happened in the original timeline.

Now to read Doc Jensen.

EDIT: I like "The Adversary" as a title for Evil Dude.
- Jack was lying to Sawyer about his Kate-related motivation. Sure, he cares about Kate, but I think he was just telling Sawyer his motivation in ways Sawyer could understand, since "It's destiny" wasn't going to work.

[lisa_simpson]

Probably focusing on Jacob and anti-Jacob, maybe throw in some Faraday, Claire and Widmore stuff, maybe even the retired couple, as well. And the reveal will come at the end of an episode that will seem like a flashback, then we will see the reveal that it wasn't a flashback at the end.

I think it's pretty much a given that we've seen the last of Bernard and Rose.  Their story is done.  Claire, however - well, Darlton did say quite unequivocally that Emilie de Ravin would be back for season six and Claire would figure quite prominently.

[Armchair_QB]

Probably focusing on Jacob and anti-Jacob, maybe throw in some Faraday, Claire and Widmore stuff, maybe even the retired couple, as well. And the reveal will come at the end of an episode that will seem like a flashback, then we will see the reveal that it wasn't a flashback at the end.

I think it's pretty much a given that we've seen the last of Bernard and Rose.  Their story is done.  Claire, however - well, Darlton did say quite unequivocally that Emilie de Ravin would be back for season six and Claire would figure quite prominently.

We still don't know who "Adam and Eve" were. My guess is that we find out next season and it's Bernard and Rose.

[ArnoldBabar]

Probably focusing on Jacob and anti-Jacob, maybe throw in some Faraday, Claire and Widmore stuff, maybe even the retired couple, as well. And the reveal will come at the end of an episode that will seem like a flashback, then we will see the reveal that it wasn't a flashback at the end.

I think it's pretty much a given that we've seen the last of Bernard and Rose.  Their story is done.  Claire, however - well, Darlton did say quite unequivocally that Emilie de Ravin would be back for season six and Claire would figure quite prominently.

We still don't know who "Adam and Eve" were. My guess is that we find out next season and it's Bernard and Rose.

Gotta be them. Except since everyone seems to think that, it wouldn't surprise me if they switched it up.

[pressboxramblings07]

perhaps this question has already been posed, but what about christian? can we assume mr. satan man took his form, too?

[BRoth]

Probably focusing on Jacob and anti-Jacob, maybe throw in some Faraday, Claire and Widmore stuff, maybe even the retired couple, as well. And the reveal will come at the end of an episode that will seem like a flashback, then we will see the reveal that it wasn't a flashback at the end.

I think it's pretty much a given that we've seen the last of Bernard and Rose.  Their story is done.  Claire, however - well, Darlton did say quite unequivocally that Emilie de Ravin would be back for season six and Claire would figure quite prominently.

We still don't know who "Adam and Eve" were. My guess is that we find out next season and it's Bernard and Rose.

Gotta be them. Except since everyone seems to think that, it wouldn't surprise me if they switched it up.

Maybe it was me, but did anyone else get a creepy vibe from Rose when the Losties were leaving the mini-camp her and Bernard set up? She gave what looked to me a mean look and there was some creepy music played underneath as they were parting ways.

I assumed it was nothing, but did anyone else catch that?

[ArnoldBabar]

I think Rose just looks down her nose at the Losties and their drama, plus they did just tell her the island might about to blow up because of it.

I'm rewatching now, and highly recommend it. There's a lot more to pick up on once you know the deal with Locke.

[Webster]

I noticed that they really made Ben look shorter the last couple of episodes

[NDub]

- I wondered if they had cut Jacob's visit from Juliet's flashback, or if they meant to be clear that he had not visited her at what was a pivotal moment.

I think they meant to show that Jacob never visited Juliet. She ends up being the person who ignites the bomb and either creates The Incident (Miles' theory) or she changes time (Jack's theory). I haven't read Doc yet, but posters on here indicated he thinks Juliet is the variable. Makes sense.

- His visit to Sayid was different. Sayid was with Nadia, perfectly happy to leave the Island behind. And her death was what got him involved again, via Ben Linus recruiting him to be an assassin.

Jacob's visit to Sayid did come after the O-6 left The Island. Everyone else got the visit before they came on Oceanic 815 - Jack after that well-known surgery, Kate as a 10-ish year-old, 8-10-year-old Sawyer after his parents murder-suicide, and Sun and Jin after their wedding.

Perhaps this is why Sayid was shot. Or was closer to death before or more than anyone else. Hurley's visit also came after he was off The Island, though. Jacob wanted him to go back and found him after he was released from prison. What's the significance of that?

Or does it matter when Jacob visited these people? Just as long as he did? Perhaps Hurley and Sayid were the two most against going back???

[ArnoldBabar]

My thinking is that Jacob is trying to course correct each person at a pivotal time, to change what happens from this point on the ... whatever the overall timeline we're in now is called. And it all happened previous to "now," so I guess it wouldn't matter if it's before or after 815, right?

[CentralIllinoisan]

I'm leaning more toward Jacob being on the wrong side of this ... especially if his vessel turns out to be the pilot, played Jeff Fahey -- who plays a helluva villain.

[NDub]

I'm leaning more toward Jacob being on the wrong side of this ... especially if his vessel turns out to be the pilot, played Jeff Fahey -- who plays a helluva villain.

The pilot as in Lapidis? Or the guy who was killed in the pilot episode that replaced Lapidis? No one knows why that happened.

[DirtyDeeds]

Have to agree with Piotr. Doesn't make much sense that the nuclear blast was The Incident, and I think The Incident was clearly taking place before Juliet set off the bomb. Many other good points there, too.

Local storms caused me to miss the first 40 minutes. Guess the power to the DVR went out for a while. Of all the nights ... Guess I need to get online and rewatch. They don't still replay it during the weekend, do they?

And I'm wondering if I only have this question because I missed most of Jacob's visits (or I'm just an idiot), but why would it be significant that Juliet was not visited by Jacob? Like ID sez, Richard brought her to the island. She was not on either of the planes. What am I missing? Maybe I'll go read Doc.

[93Devil]

I am tracking this on a pda, and that sucks, but there is some fantastic work being done on these pages. Thanks everyone for their thoughts. It's better than any blog.

A few cannon shots...

The idea for this series probably was born about the time Angles and Demons was penned, right?  How about a men of science helping the men, or Gods, against absolute evil.

I think when Jacob visited these men is very important. Why? Who knows?  But many were visited around 1977.

Not sure if I read it here or not, but Esau actually was the one that tricked locke into killing himself by posing as Locke. Damn.

I love the biblical theme. And Sayid saying that were are going to use the camaflouge (spell) of being right out in the open could well work with the producers.

Do you think a nucleur blast would knock that statue down to its ankles? 
The actor who plays 9harley has nothing booked for the next year if I remember correctly.

Anyone look up that book?

So how did Locke know all this crazy stuff in seasons 1 and 2?  Like when it was going to rain and that the dynamite would not blow him to hell?

OK, I'm going to stop, but if this show ends as strong as the Sopranoes, I think it could be considered the best ever.

[CUinthenewsroom]

Some more random thoughts:

1. Rose and Bernard are Adam and Eve skeletons. It makes sense and this season showed that the writers weren't afraid to make the obvious answer the correct answer (see Miles-Pierre Chang, etc.). Lost likes to save the big twists for plot points, not details (to an extent).

2. Jeff Fahey, who plays Lapidis, is a (very, very) distant relative of mine. Definitely never met him, don't think anyone in the fam that I know has met him.

3. Dirty, watch the whole thing and you will understand the potential implication from Jacob not visiting Juliet. Especially because she was more than just the one who set off the bomb ... she really was the driving force. I mean, Jack ran with it and all, but Juliet's actions and decisions are largely what got them all to that spot at that time. For a second I thought she might have been running a very long con and still working for someone else.

4. 93, I do think the statue was knocked down by the blast ... it makes sense. And Doc looked up the book, so read his latest when you get a chance.

[DirtyDeeds]

Now I'm REALLY pissed that I missed the beginning. Not to mention I missed how they got off the sub. I'll have to watch when I get home tonight. My DVR started when they were in the jungle talking to Rose and Bernard, so I think I missed a lot.

[pressboxramblings07]

i have so much going through my head i really can't put it all down into words.

instead, i'll just say this is the greatest television show i have ever seen. and it's not close.

[ArnoldBabar]

I'm not sure he didn't visit Juliet. Maybe we just didn't see it. She went running out of the house ... doesn't mean Jacob didn't show up.

[schiezainc]

Just read Doc's column and what he said about the Jacob visits made me really excited about Season Six.

What if the bomb being set off sends all of the castaways that were there (Hurley, Jin, Sawyer, Jack, Kate) back to the point in their lives that Jacob visited them at...except this time with the knowledge of what has already happened?

They'd get a second chance to make key decisions (To get on the plane or not?) and could play a gigantic role in shaping the events that happened (I.E. Hurley can tell Charlie and Claire not to go to the Island).

If that's the case, I'll go crazy next year.

And as for my opinion that last night wasn't a cliffhanger, what I meant was that I feel like it tied up all the loose ends ...of season five.

Yes, we don't know everything. Hell, we don't know a lot. But I feel the final shot was a really good way to go out because it is a logical break in the story telling. If you look at Lost as a series of books, for instance, this would be a good place to end one book and start a new one.

I thought they'd give us a little tease of Season Six but I'm happy overall with how things went last night.